32 GB memory stick

[Mack A. Damia]

I feel such a fool relying on my memory and creating a new form of 9/8
marching in my mind. Idiot that I am!
-- choro

Brother, I wish I could play like this.

You see, he was a link - a link between the glory of classical music
and the ordinary folks who didn't quite get it - but they came to love
both Liberace and his music. You have to put things into perspective.

 

[J. P. Gilliver (John)]

[snippage ...! In this case, it took me more than a moment to find the
bit I wanted to reply to.]

On Fri, 18 Nov 2011 17:18:06 -0800, "Gene E. Bloch"

In my view, they don't come remotely close to op. 109, 110, and 111.

[]
I don't agree. I think they are beautiful pieces of music, but they
aren't among the best sonatas Beethoven composed - unless you want to
set yourself above the experts.

[]
I think a lot of the fun of the sort of discussion we are having here
is, indeed, setting oneself above the experts - or, to put it with less
hubris, disagreeing with the "experts". Or, more significantly,
disagreeing with "received wisdom", which has often absorbed certain
"facts" to the extent that no-one _thinks_ to challenge them any more.
(Like my views on Shakespeare.)

 

[Mack A. Damia]

[snippage ...! In this case, it took me more than a moment to find the
bit I wanted to reply to.]

On Fri, 18 Nov 2011 17:18:06 -0800, "Gene E. Bloch"

In my view, they don't come remotely close to op. 109, 110, and 111.

[]
I don't agree. I think they are beautiful pieces of music, but they
aren't among the best sonatas Beethoven composed - unless you want to
set yourself above the experts.

[]
I think a lot of the fun of the sort of discussion we are having here
is, indeed, setting oneself above the experts - or, to put it with less
hubris, disagreeing with the "experts". Or, more significantly,
disagreeing with "received wisdom", which has often absorbed certain
"facts" to the extent that no-one _thinks_ to challenge them any more.
(Like my views on Shakespeare.)

After I wrote that, I asked myself, "Who are the experts?" I think
it's the public in general who determines what is good and what is not
good , and in one sense, that makes them (or "us") the "experts".

There are music experts and musicologist who parse and analyze music
note by note, but in the final analysis it's the general public that
determines the best and most popular - and it's as simple as a
pleasasnt melody and catachy lyrics.

 

[J. P. Gilliver (John)]

Well, I found the percussion superfluous[1]...And I wouldn't want to

[]

Sounds like a very competent and quite inspired rendering. But knowing
about the "Turkish" piano, I now, whenever hearing the piece, find
myself waiting _for_ the percussion!
[]

I should have qualified my original remark. I don't mean it as a
universal truth, but as a statement of my own likes and dislikes. Unlike
how some other posters in this group *seem* to think, I do know that
when it comes to musical preferences, YMWV, your mileage *will* vary,
for all possible values of "you".
Indeed.
[]
I wasn't referring to where the percussion was, but only to how I liked
it (namely, not!). After a bit, it did become clear from the related
material that the sounds came from the piano, not from a drummer sitting
nearby.

Fair enough. You like the piece differently from how it was written -
though in this case, the variation is better known than the original,
probably because pianos with such extras aren't common these days!

I too like to hear novel variations in the way of performing well-known
pieces. In many cases, they do not work, sometimes disastrously so
(although this is nearly _always_ a matter of opinion!), but sometimes
they do. I have a recording of (Chai's) "Waltz of the Flowers" arranged
for 8 pianos: I'm still not sure about that one, but it is certainly
novel. (I am probably overly fond of the original orchestral version,
probably as it was - on cassette! - one of the first pieces of classical
music I owned, in a rendering by Bert and the BP band.)

A lot of such rearrangements are in the popular music sphere, and many
purists despair: to give an extreme example, Saint-Saens' organ
symphony, arranged as the pop song "If I had Words", and then used to
serenade a pig in the film "Babe" - but, if that brings a few people to
listen to the magnificent original ...

(And of course Sky's "Toccata" which we have already discussed: I enjoy
both that and the original JSB organ piece.)

On a different though closely related subject, I have a slight
preference for very short works, which the classical world is decidedly
uneasy about, and this isn't just a feature of the modern world -
Kreisler had to implement a little deception.

 

[Daniel James]

The trouble with snipping text is that it takes some effort to do
a good snip. It necessitates some thinking. It is easier NOT to
snip.

Usenet is rather like a sewer ... the more you put into it the more you
can get out of it! (With apologies to Tom Lehrer.)

IOW Posting /without/ making an effort leads to poor posts, which will
give little satisfaction to the poster and are likely to be ignored by
others.

Your choice ...

Cheers,
Daniel.

 

[Ed Cryer]

About the brass: I remember once reading something like "there are
two sides to a trumpeter. There is the side that likes to play with
vigour, tattering all the other instruments into shreds in his
wake; and then there is the dark side." (I like a good bit of brass
- Sibelius wrote a few ...) []

Yes, he did, didn't he? And did you know that as a composer he was
being supported by the Finnish state. May be Ed Cryer should make a
mental note of this fact.

Music for the masses, I say, not just for a court! Who was that
American composer who composed "Fanfare for the common man"?

And about the brass section... If you want your ear drums burst, just
sit in front of the trombones and French horns. They can get much
louder than trumpets or strumpets! -- choro

PS. Q- What do you do if you want two piccolo players to play in
perfect unison? A- Shoot one of them!

Beethoven was supported by Viennese aristocrats. They gave him money and
gifts, and in exchange he dedicated works to them.

You must realize how times change. If you go saying that people like
Bach, Mozart and Haydn worked for royal courts, then you have to look at
the society of the time. That was where the composing work came from;
the commisions and pay. The orchestras were created and paid at royal
courts. The self-financing orchestras of later years came in after
radical changes to society.

Ed

P.S.
Don't think too badly of me. This is a fantastic thread. I feel proud
to have been the OP, but you've put so much effort and energy into it
that I'd cast you as Samuel Taylor Coleridge. He was, by all
accounts, a very firebrand in his early days, always coming up with
new and revolutionary ideas. He inspired lots including good friends
William and Dorothy Wordsworth.

Some people use their minds a lot, others don't. I've always been
interested in just what it is that makes the Einsteins, the
Beethovens, the Nietzsches, the van Goghs. We're almost all born with
the same physical brain structure, but some develop and become far
more creative than others. That has to be in the nurture; and that
has to come from stimulation while growing up.

You can bring kids up in a house full of books, good classical music,
full access to the Net etc., but in my humble opinion it's the
interaction with other people that turns the future genius towards
them. And your type of open discussion that ranges across the wide
scope of interesting subjects does more for that than anything else.

Ed

 

[choro]

About the brass: I remember once reading something like "there are
two sides to a trumpeter. There is the side that likes to play with
vigour, tattering all the other instruments into shreds in his
wake; and then there is the dark side." (I like a good bit of brass
- Sibelius wrote a few ...) []

Yes, he did, didn't he? And did you know that as a composer he was
being supported by the Finnish state. May be Ed Cryer should make a
mental note of this fact.

Music for the masses, I say, not just for a court! Who was that
American composer who composed "Fanfare for the common man"?

And about the brass section... If you want your ear drums burst, just
sit in front of the trombones and French horns. They can get much
louder than trumpets or strumpets! -- choro

PS. Q- What do you do if you want two piccolo players to play in
perfect unison? A- Shoot one of them!

Beethoven was supported by Viennese aristocrats. They gave him money and
gifts, and in exchange he dedicated works to them.

You must realize how times change. If you go saying that people like
Bach, Mozart and Haydn worked for royal courts, then you have to look at
the society of the time. That was where the composing work came from;
the commisions and pay. The orchestras were created and paid at royal
courts. The self-financing orchestras of later years came in after
radical changes to society.

Subscription concerts started after Haydn and Mozart. True, the
subscribers again must have been the aristocrats and the wealthy
burghers but at least it was the beginning of public concerts. What is
the use of or the benefit of art being restricted to courts and
courtiers? Just think for a moment how YOU could have benefited from all
that art had you lived in those times as an average citizen?

Ed

P.S.
Don't think too badly of me. This is a fantastic thread. I feel proud
to have been the OP, but you've put so much effort and energy into it
that I'd cast you as Samuel Taylor Coleridge. He was, by all
accounts, a very firebrand in his early days, always coming up with
new and revolutionary ideas. He inspired lots including good friends
William and Dorothy Wordsworth.

I don't think badly of anybody. Well, more or less anybody if I am to be
honest about myself. And I certainly do not think badly of you. You had
a point to make and a valid one, I have to admit. But you see, in the
final analysis what is the use of art if less than 1% of the population
have access to it?

Some people use their minds a lot, others don't. I've always been
interested in just what it is that makes the Einsteins, the
Beethovens, the Nietzsches, the van Goghs. We're almost all born with
the same physical brain structure, but some develop and become far
more creative than others. That has to be in the nurture; and that
has to come from stimulation while growing up.

I can't claim that I use my mind a lot but at least I try to see things
from an unbiased point of view. And I have certainly had a lot of
experience through life both due to my years as well as my life
experiences. Hopefully I am a wiser person than I was half a century
ago. I have been through the mill, as the expression goes and I have
experienced life at all or most levels. I certainly hope that I have
left behind the baggage life imposed on me in my younger days.

You can bring kids up in a house full of books, good classical music,
full access to the Net etc., but in my humble opinion it's the
interaction with other people that turns the future genius towards
them. And your type of open discussion that ranges across the wide
scope of interesting subjects does more for that than anything else.

Having been brought up in three cultures and having been exposed to even
more cultures has probably led to various clashes within me which define
what I am today. Sometimes I wish I were a simpleton or the village
idiot. They most probably lead happier lives.

But still, I am what I am and cannot go back.

However, there is one thing I can say and that is that being engaged in
this exchange of views on these two unlikely newsgroups has given me a
lot of pleasure.

Ed

Once again, thank you as well as the others on these two newsgroups and
may this conversation/thread go down as the longest ever in the annals
of Usenet!
-- choro

 

[choro]

Brother, I wish I could play like this.

You see, he was a link - a link between the glory of classical music
and the ordinary folks who didn't quite get it - but they came to love
both Liberace and his music. You have to put things into perspective.

Whether you wish you could play at least like that is completely
irrelevant. My time is limited by the 24 hour day and I like to put it
to best use.

Whether Liberace and others like him provided a service in getting
people interested in classical or rather more serious music is not the
point of this conversation. But rather exceptionally gifted musicians
are what I thought we were trying to discuss. And Liberace was certainly
not one of them.

But if his playing is your cup of tea, then by all means listen to him.

But drawing a gastronomic paradigm, if you are happy eating hot dogs
with mainly mechanically recovered chicken, then well and good. Or
should I have said McDonald's burghers?
-- choro

 

[choro]

Well, I found the percussion superfluous[1]...And I wouldn't want to

[]

Sounds like a very competent and quite inspired rendering. But knowing
about the "Turkish" piano, I now, whenever hearing the piece, find
myself waiting _for_ the percussion!
[]

I should have qualified my original remark. I don't mean it as a
universal truth, but as a statement of my own likes and dislikes. Unlike
how some other posters in this group *seem* to think, I do know that
when it comes to musical preferences, YMWV, your mileage *will* vary,
for all possible values of "you".
Indeed.
[]
I wasn't referring to where the percussion was, but only to how I liked
it (namely, not!). After a bit, it did become clear from the related
material that the sounds came from the piano, not from a drummer sitting
nearby.

Fair enough. You like the piece differently from how it was written -
though in this case, the variation is better known than the original,
probably because pianos with such extras aren't common these days!

I too like to hear novel variations in the way of performing well-known
pieces. In many cases, they do not work, sometimes disastrously so
(although this is nearly _always_ a matter of opinion!), but sometimes
they do. I have a recording of (Chai's) "Waltz of the Flowers" arranged
for 8 pianos: I'm still not sure about that one, but it is certainly
novel. (I am probably overly fond of the original orchestral version,
probably as it was - on cassette! - one of the first pieces of classical
music I owned, in a rendering by Bert and the BP band.)

A lot of such rearrangements are in the popular music sphere, and many
purists despair: to give an extreme example, Saint-Saens' organ
symphony, arranged as the pop song "If I had Words", and then used to
serenade a pig in the film "Babe" - but, if that brings a few people to
listen to the magnificent original ...

(And of course Sky's "Toccata" which we have already discussed: I enjoy
both that and the original JSB organ piece.)

On a different though closely related subject, I have a slight
preference for very short works, which the classical world is decidedly
uneasy about, and this isn't just a feature of the modern world -
Kreisler had to implement a little deception.

Below is the URL to the Wikipedia page where you can read a bit on the
subject. Also of interest is the very bottom sound clip you can play of
the Alla Turca which will give us an idea of those embellished pianos of
those days with cymbal sounds.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piano_Sonata_No._11_(Mozart)

Unfortunately the player takes it just a bit too fast and the music
suffers in one or two places.

I doubt very much that Mozart actually wrote the movement for such a
piano. But I am sure that playing that movement on such pianos must have
been quite popular in those days. Don't forget it was a fad!

Things don't change that much though fads do! They also had upright
grand pianos, the so-called *giraffe pianos*! Can you imagine an upright
concert grand? Though I guess the drawback was that the soundboard faced
the walls, same as on an upright piano.

I wonder whether the word "footprint" existed in those days? A concert
grand with the footprint of an upright!

http://orgs.usd.edu/nmm/Keyboards/SchimmelNelsonPiano/1212/Schimmel.html

Actually I was looking for the photo I saw ages ago of a particular
giraffe piano but it doesn't appear to have been posted to the Internet.
It was really a very grand piano with an elaborately carved case which
was a work of art in itself. It was OK for some, I guess just like it is
OK for some today; particularly bankers and brokers!
-- choro

 

[J. P. Gilliver (John)]

But still, I am what I am and cannot go back.

Ah, that song about the giant vegetable, of which I think Shirley Bassey
gives the best performance.

However, there is one thing I can say and that is that being engaged in
this exchange of views on these two unlikely newsgroups has given me a
lot of pleasure.

Me too. Though I can't help wondering what the other denizens are
thinking, especially of the Windows one!
[]

 

[J. P. Gilliver (John)]

Whether Liberace and others like him provided a service in getting
people interested in classical or rather more serious music is not the
point of this conversation. But rather exceptionally gifted musicians
are what I thought we were trying to discuss. And Liberace was
certainly not one of them.

Ooh, do I detect a certain snootiness?

But if his playing is your cup of tea, then by all means listen to him.

Yes, I definitely do (-:!

But drawing a gastronomic paradigm, if you are happy eating hot dogs
with mainly mechanically recovered chicken, then well and good. Or
should I have said McDonald's burghers?

Hmm. Much is said about their ingredients, but I don't think they are
made from burghers!

-- choro

John - off to shop and then have a Mac, soon!

 

[J. P. Gilliver (John)]

Below is the URL to the Wikipedia page where you can read a bit on the
subject. Also of interest is the very bottom sound clip you can play of
the Alla Turca which will give us an idea of those embellished pianos
of those days with cymbal sounds.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piano_Sonata_No._11_(Mozart)

(I posted one of Richard Burnett playing the one in the Finchcocks
collection, earlier in this thread.) That's quite a fast rendering, and
also with quite a curl in the rhythm: however, either that piano didn't
have the drum attachment, or he was much more retrained than Richard
(especially in performances later than the one I posted the link to).

Unfortunately the player takes it just a bit too fast and the music
suffers in one or two places.

Yes, I noticed a few "bum notes" after about two-thirds through!

I doubt very much that Mozart actually wrote the movement for such a
piano. But I am sure that playing that movement on such pianos must
have been quite popular in those days. Don't forget it was a fad!

You're probably right. (Though ... why the name? Could have just
referred to the rhythm, I suppose.)

Things don't change that much though fads do! They also had upright
grand pianos, the so-called *giraffe pianos*! Can you imagine an
upright concert grand? Though I guess the drawback was that the
soundboard faced the walls, same as on an upright piano.

I wonder whether the word "footprint" existed in those days? A concert
grand with the footprint of an upright!

http://orgs.usd.edu/nmm/Keyboards/SchimmelNelsonPiano/1212/Schimmel.html

Interesting. Finchcocks has assorted shapes and designs:
http://www.finchcocks.co.uk/pages/catalogue.html
unfortunately few pictures. But definitely including some tall pianos,
of assorted shapes (including at least one with the highest point in the
middle rather than at one side).
[]

just like it is OK for some today; particularly bankers and brokers!
-- choro

Ah, you remind me of my friend Gerry, alias the British Vintage Wireless
and Television Museum, who has described some of the sets in his
collection as clearly designed for used-car salesmen. I can't find the
picture of the set in question on http://www.bvwtm.org.uk/tour/, but it
is definitely there.

 

[Mack A. Damia]

Whether you wish you could play at least like that is completely
irrelevant. My time is limited by the 24 hour day and I like to put it
to best use.

Good for you. I can do work AND listen to music at the same time. How
about you?

Whether Liberace and others like him provided a service in getting
people interested in classical or rather more serious music is not the
point of this conversation. But rather exceptionally gifted musicians
are what I thought we were trying to discuss. And Liberace was certainly
not one of them.

There was no advanced program detailing what would and would not be
discussed. You are making false assumptions. This was an open
discussion about classical music in a very general sense. You're not
a control freak, are you?

But if his playing is your cup of tea, then by all means listen to him.

I don't own a recording by him, but I don't mind his playing. You
don't have to get your knickers into a twist just becasue the name
"Liberace" is mentioned. You are beginning to sound like a prig, and
I thought we were having a decent discussion a couple of days ago.

But drawing a gastronomic paradigm, if you are happy eating hot dogs
with mainly mechanically recovered chicken, then well and good. Or
should I have said McDonald's burghers?

Cannibalism? I think not. But I've stopped eating burgers and red
meat in general for health reasons.

Now, a barbecued chicken bought at our local Walmarts is yummy. I've
never tasted as good - even in a restaurant, and I've eaten in fine
restaurants all over the world.

 

[Ed Cryer]

Ooh, do I detect a certain snootiness?

Yes, I definitely do (-:!

Hmm. Much is said about their ingredients, but I don't think they are
made from burghers!


John - off to shop and then have a Mac, soon!

Liberace was glam-and-glitter-and-not-much-else. He never inspired me;
in fact he turned me off. He used to have candelabra on the end of his
piano, and after parading round the stage like a prima ballerina and
asking "Do you like the rings?" (flash of luxury and decadent western
culture to the TV screen) he'd go into a version of Chopsticks.

I was a babe in arms at the time, but old enough to see the difference
between culture and trash.

Ed

 

[Mack A. Damia]

Liberace was glam-and-glitter-and-not-much-else. He never inspired me;
in fact he turned me off. He used to have candelabra on the end of his
piano, and after parading round the stage like a prima ballerina and
asking "Do you like the rings?" (flash of luxury and decadent western
culture to the TV screen) he'd go into a version of Chopsticks.

I was a babe in arms at the time, but old enough to see the difference
between culture and trash.

He was a decent pianist with a large following. Listen to him on
YouTube. He only became flashy towards the end of his career, and if
you look at some of his earlier programs, you won't see any rings on
his fingers.

 

[Ed Cryer]

[]
Whether Liberace and others like him provided a service in getting
people interested in classical or rather more serious music is not the
point of this conversation. But rather exceptionally gifted musicians
are what I thought we were trying to discuss. And Liberace was
certainly not one of them.

Ooh, do I detect a certain snootiness?

But if his playing is your cup of tea, then by all means listen to him.

Yes, I definitely do (-:!

But drawing a gastronomic paradigm, if you are happy eating hot dogs
with mainly mechanically recovered chicken, then well and good. Or
should I have said McDonald's burghers?

Hmm. Much is said about their ingredients, but I don't think they are
made from burghers!

-- choro

John - off to shop and then have a Mac, soon!

Liberace was glam-and-glitter-and-not-much-else. He never inspired me;
in fact he turned me off. He used to have candelabra on the end of his
piano, and after parading round the stage like a prima ballerina and
asking "Do you like the rings?" (flash of luxury and decadent western
culture to the TV screen) he'd go into a version of Chopsticks.

I was a babe in arms at the time, but old enough to see the difference
between culture and trash.

He was a decent pianist with a large following. Listen to him on
YouTube. He only became flashy towards the end of his career, and if
you look at some of his earlier programs, you won't see any rings on
his fingers.

Give me a URL on Youtube and I'll watch & listen.

Ed

 

[Mack A. Damia]

On 19/11/2011 19:01, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
[]
Whether Liberace and others like him provided a service in getting
people interested in classical or rather more serious music is not the
point of this conversation. But rather exceptionally gifted musicians
are what I thought we were trying to discuss. And Liberace was
certainly not one of them.

Ooh, do I detect a certain snootiness?

But if his playing is your cup of tea, then by all means listen to him.

Yes, I definitely do (-:!

But drawing a gastronomic paradigm, if you are happy eating hot dogs
with mainly mechanically recovered chicken, then well and good. Or
should I have said McDonald's burghers?

Hmm. Much is said about their ingredients, but I don't think they are
made from burghers!

-- choro

John - off to shop and then have a Mac, soon!

Liberace was glam-and-glitter-and-not-much-else. He never inspired me;
in fact he turned me off. He used to have candelabra on the end of his
piano, and after parading round the stage like a prima ballerina and
asking "Do you like the rings?" (flash of luxury and decadent western
culture to the TV screen) he'd go into a version of Chopsticks.

I was a babe in arms at the time, but old enough to see the difference
between culture and trash.

He was a decent pianist with a large following. Listen to him on
YouTube. He only became flashy towards the end of his career, and if
you look at some of his earlier programs, you won't see any rings on
his fingers.

Give me a URL on Youtube and I'll watch & listen.

Ed, there must be dozens. Here's one. I don't see any rings.

Damn! I wish I could play like him! I don't play the piano at all.

 

[choro]

(I posted one of Richard Burnett playing the one in the Finchcocks
collection, earlier in this thread.) That's quite a fast rendering, and
also with quite a curl in the rhythm: however, either that piano didn't
have the drum attachment, or he was much more retrained than Richard
(especially in performances later than the one I posted the link to).

Yes, I noticed a few "bum notes" after about two-thirds through!

You're probably right. (Though ... why the name? Could have just
referred to the rhythm, I suppose.)

I would have thought so. To me it sounds like he was trying to create
the spirit of the Janissary March. The rhythm or rather the mofif of the
first 5 notes depicts the Janissary march of LRL-|RLR-| with no actual
step taken on beat 4 when the marchers swing round to face the people
watching the march on the side of the foot that happens to be forward on
that beat. Of course, the fierce gaze straight into the eyes of the
people is fairly awesome and alternates with each bar of the music. I
would have thought this was a ceremonial march, of course, designed to
instill awe in the people watching the march.

Let's not forget that Mozart also wrote a whole opera with a Turkish
theme, set in the Turkish or rather the then Ottoman "Saray" or royal
palace though "Serail" or "Seraglio" are taken to mean the just the
Harem section of the palace. The "Bab-ı Ali" which is commonly known in
Europe as the "Sublime Porte" was the real working wing where matters of
state were dealt with...

Die Entführung aus dem Serail (K. 384; The Abduction from the Seraglio;
also known as Il Seraglio) is an opera Singspiel in three acts by
Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart.
-- choro

Things don't change that much though fads do! They also had upright
grand pianos, the so-called *giraffe pianos*! Can you imagine an
upright concert grand? Though I guess the drawback was that the
soundboard faced the walls, same as on an upright piano.

I wonder whether the word "footprint" existed in those days? A concert
grand with the footprint of an upright!

http://orgs.usd.edu/nmm/Keyboards/SchimmelNelsonPiano/1212/Schimmel.html

Interesting. Finchcocks has assorted shapes and designs:
http://www.finchcocks.co.uk/pages/catalogue.html
unfortunately few pictures. But definitely including some tall pianos,
of assorted shapes (including at least one with the highest point in the
middle rather than at one side).
[]

just like it is OK for some today; particularly bankers and brokers!
-- choro

Ah, you remind me of my friend Gerry, alias the British Vintage Wireless
and Television Museum, who has described some of the sets in his
collection as clearly designed for used-car salesmen. I can't find the
picture of the set in question on http://www.bvwtm.org.uk/tour/, but it
is definitely there.

 

[choro]

Ah, that song about the giant vegetable, of which I think Shirley Bassey
gives the best performance.

I like(d) Shirley Bassey especially when she was younger and used to
appear in that low cut dress at the back; cut down to her you know what!
But can't recollect the song that is on your mind.

These days I love listening to Edith Piaf. Incredible chanteuse of
French chanson! But if you like singing you should also listen to
Cantaloupe, Songs of the Auvergne, sung by Vittorio de Los Angeles. I've
got two other versions on CD but her version is best.

Also Google for...

Schubert lieder Peter Schreier Hermann Prey Gerald Moore

Dietrich Fischer Diskau will also show up, of course. And Gerald Moore
is a superb accompanist of the highest calibre.
-- choro

However, there is one thing I can say and that is that being engaged
in this exchange of views on these two unlikely newsgroups has given
me a lot of pleasure.

Me too. Though I can't help wondering what the other denizens are
thinking, especially of the Windows one!
[]

 

[choro]

Ooh, do I detect a certain snootiness?

Yes, I definitely do (-:!

Hmm. Much is said about their ingredients, but I don't think they are
made from burghers!

May be the burghers should have been minced, after all. And why not?
They could have made better burgers!

Incidentally, I've just had some home made burgers I made myself. Made
from lean steak mince! But minced lamb or pork are also fine. Or how
about a mixture of minced meats? But have some fresh parsley handy
though! It's an optional non-optional ingredient, if you see what I mean!
-- choro