Where are library contents stored?

[Ken Springer]

My apologies for the somewhat misleading subject line, but after 10
minutes of pondering, couldn't come up with anything better.

First, yes I'm aware that the actual files/contents of a library are
stored elsewhere, the library is just a list of contents.
Working/dealing with those are the intended subject.

Background:

I'm one that does not believe in having user data on the boot drive. On
a time available basis, I'm helping a friend of mine relocate the
folders in her user documents to another partition on her laptop hard drive.

I want to do the same with Library data, but so far web searches have
been of no value, or the article is actually talking about the actual
documents and folders, not the "library" entries you see when you open a
library in Windows Explorer.

Somewhere, there has to be a file or something that records what the
contents of a library are, be it folders, files, or shortcuts.

I'm looking for the data that lists the folders and shortcuts contained
in any library. I want to relocate that information to another
partition as well as any user created library. That way, should the OS
need to be reinstalled, the libraries do not have to be rebuilt. A
restore from a System Image should contain the information on where the
library contents are now stored, similar to the users documents.

This obviously needs to include user created documents.

Suggestions? Questions?

--
Ken

Mac OS X 10.8.2
Firefox 19.0
Thunderbird 17.0.3
LibreOffice 3.6.5.2

 

[BobbyM]

My apologies for the somewhat misleading subject line, but after 10
minutes of pondering, couldn't come up with anything better.

First, yes I'm aware that the actual files/contents of a library are
stored elsewhere, the library is just a list of contents.
Working/dealing with those are the intended subject.

Background:

I'm one that does not believe in having user data on the boot drive. On
a time available basis, I'm helping a friend of mine relocate the
folders in her user documents to another partition on her laptop hard
drive.

I want to do the same with Library data, but so far web searches have
been of no value, or the article is actually talking about the actual
documents and folders, not the "library" entries you see when you open a
library in Windows Explorer.

Somewhere, there has to be a file or something that records what the
contents of a library are, be it folders, files, or shortcuts.

I'm looking for the data that lists the folders and shortcuts contained
in any library. I want to relocate that information to another
partition as well as any user created library. That way, should the OS
need to be reinstalled, the libraries do not have to be rebuilt. A
restore from a System Image should contain the information on where the
library contents are now stored, similar to the users documents.

This obviously needs to include user created documents.

Suggestions? Questions?

Open up the "libraries" folder if you have an icon on your desktop. If
not, Click on "my computer" or "computer' as it's now called & then
click on "libraries". Click on a specific library, such as "documents".
With the library open, at the top of library folder, will be the name
of the library, such as "Documents library". Under that will be
"includes: x location(s)". Click on "x location(s)" to reveal the
actual location(s) of the files in that particular library.

 

[Wolf K]

My apologies for the somewhat misleading subject line, but after 10
minutes of pondering, couldn't come up with anything better.

First, yes I'm aware that the actual files/contents of a library are
stored elsewhere, the library is just a list of contents.
Working/dealing with those are the intended subject.

Background:

I'm one that does not believe in having user data on the boot drive. On
a time available basis, I'm helping a friend of mine relocate the
folders in her user documents to another partition on her laptop hard
drive.

I want to do the same with Library data, but so far web searches have
been of no value, or the article is actually talking about the actual
documents and folders, not the "library" entries you see when you open a
library in Windows Explorer.

Somewhere, there has to be a file or something that records what the
contents of a library are, be it folders, files, or shortcuts.

I'm looking for the data that lists the folders and shortcuts contained
in any library. I want to relocate that information to another
partition as well as any user created library. That way, should the OS
need to be reinstalled, the libraries do not have to be rebuilt. A
restore from a System Image should contain the information on where the
library contents are now stored, similar to the users documents.

This obviously needs to include user created documents.

Suggestions? Questions?

I ignore libraries. They are lists of pointers, not real folders.
Unfortunately, when you delete the pointer, Windows thinks you want to
delete the file, and it does so. Silly implementation, IMO. You either
set up a structured list of files, or you set up a container for files.
MS in its wisdom decide to mix the two concepts.

Since you are saving your data on a another drive, just set up suitably
structured and named folder trees for your data, and set all your
programs to save in those locations by default. That's what I do. Mind
you, some things end up in the Libraries anyhow, but you can move/copy
them. See, whatever you do to a "file" in a library is actually done to
the file it points to.

Bobby M. tells you how to locate the file(s) listed in the Libraries. I
vaguely recall some advice on moving the libraries themselves off the
boot drive, but that's probably just an unreliable impression. Still, it
can't hurt to find out if it can be done, if you prefer Libraries.

HTH

 

[BobbyM]

I ignore libraries. They are lists of pointers, not real folders.
Unfortunately, when you delete the pointer, Windows thinks you want to
delete the file, and it does so. Silly implementation, IMO. You either
set up a structured list of files, or you set up a container for files.
MS in its wisdom decide to mix the two concepts.

Since you are saving your data on a another drive, just set up suitably
structured and named folder trees for your data, and set all your
programs to save in those locations by default. That's what I do. Mind
you, some things end up in the Libraries anyhow, but you can move/copy
them. See, whatever you do to a "file" in a library is actually done to
the file it points to.

Bobby M. tells you how to locate the file(s) listed in the Libraries. I
vaguely recall some advice on moving the libraries themselves off the
boot drive, but that's probably just an unreliable impression. Still, it
can't hurt to find out if it can be done, if you prefer Libraries.

I don't think there's an easy way to move the libraries themselves
(maybe some kind of registry edit would be necessary). You can however
easily move the real locations of the folders in those libraries. I
like libraries but I keep nothing stored on the c drive other than the
operating system & programs. While Documents, Downloads, Music, &
Pictures, are all sections in Libraries, the actual folders & files
reside on another hard drive. (My browser's Favorites folder also
resides on another drive.)

 

[Ken Springer]

Open up the "libraries" folder if you have an icon on your desktop. If
not, Click on "my computer" or "computer' as it's now called & then
click on "libraries". Click on a specific library, such as "documents".
With the library open, at the top of library folder, will be the name
of the library, such as "Documents library". Under that will be
"includes: x location(s)". Click on "x location(s)" to reveal the
actual location(s) of the files in that particular library.

You can also get the same information by right clicking on the library,
and selecting properties.

Unfortunately, neither of these methods show/list any subfolders in the
display. Neither do they list any shortcuts you may have added to the
root level of the library. You can also drag a file from another
location to the root level of the library, and Win7 now makes a copy at
the root level. Now, you have two copies of a single file, taking up
more hard drive space.

Regardless of which method you use to get and display what's in the
library, I'm looking for where this list of information is stored, and
if it can be relocated. Not to mention the shortcuts at the root level,
which are not listed in either place.


--
Ken

Mac OS X 10.8.2
Firefox 19.0
Thunderbird 17.0.3
LibreOffice 3.6.5.2

 

[Steve Hayes]

Open up the "libraries" folder if you have an icon on your desktop. If
not, Click on "my computer" or "computer' as it's now called & then
click on "libraries". Click on a specific library, such as "documents".
With the library open, at the top of library folder, will be the name
of the library, such as "Documents library". Under that will be
"includes: x location(s)". Click on "x location(s)" to reveal the
actual location(s) of the files in that particular library.

So if you move the actual files to another location, does Windows
automatically update the library, or do you have to do it manually?

 

[Ken Springer]

I ignore libraries. They are lists of pointers, not real folders.
Unfortunately, when you delete the pointer, Windows thinks you want to
delete the file, and it does so. Silly implementation, IMO. You either
set up a structured list of files, or you set up a container for files.
MS in its wisdom decide to mix the two concepts.

I don't even use Windows regularly any more! LOL And as implemented,
not that much of a fan of the way MS has created the libraries. I have
found a way to make them do what I would want from libraries... almost.
I have to have an empty folder created and added to a library to get
what I want.

I've got an earlier thread about that, but never got an answer. Talking
with my friend that I'm helping, I came up with a workable solution.

Since you are saving your data on a another drive, just set up suitably
structured and named folder trees for your data, and set all your
programs to save in those locations by default. That's what I do. Mind
you, some things end up in the Libraries anyhow, but you can move/copy
them. See, whatever you do to a "file" in a library is actually done to
the file it points to.

She makes use of the Documents structure as set up by Win 7. But, I've
relocated those folders to the other partition, so that's been taken
care of. She can continue to use the computer just the way she always
has, but her data is now on a different partition.

But the libraries are another issue, and some quick experimenting with
libraries and files need to be done at my end to get it all (hopefully)
figured out.

Bobby M. tells you how to locate the file(s) listed in the Libraries. I
vaguely recall some advice on moving the libraries themselves off the
boot drive, but that's probably just an unreliable impression. Still, it
can't hurt to find out if it can be done, if you prefer Libraries.

I remember similar, just don't remember where.


--
Ken

Mac OS X 10.8.2
Firefox 19.0
Thunderbird 17.0.3
LibreOffice 3.6.5.2

 

[Paul]

My apologies for the somewhat misleading subject line, but after 10
minutes of pondering, couldn't come up with anything better.

First, yes I'm aware that the actual files/contents of a library are
stored elsewhere, the library is just a list of contents.
Working/dealing with those are the intended subject.

Background:

I'm one that does not believe in having user data on the boot drive. On
a time available basis, I'm helping a friend of mine relocate the
folders in her user documents to another partition on her laptop hard
drive.

I want to do the same with Library data, but so far web searches have
been of no value, or the article is actually talking about the actual
documents and folders, not the "library" entries you see when you open a
library in Windows Explorer.

Somewhere, there has to be a file or something that records what the
contents of a library are, be it folders, files, or shortcuts.

I'm looking for the data that lists the folders and shortcuts contained
in any library. I want to relocate that information to another
partition as well as any user created library. That way, should the OS
need to be reinstalled, the libraries do not have to be rebuilt. A
restore from a System Image should contain the information on where the
library contents are now stored, similar to the users documents.

This obviously needs to include user created documents.

Suggestions? Questions?

http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/magazine/dd861346.aspx

"A library in Windows 7 is stored as an XML definition
file that has a file extension of .library-ms."

I don't know if that'll help, but it might be a start.
At least it doesn't use the registry.

Paul

 

[Nil]

Regardless of which method you use to get and display what's in
the library, I'm looking for where this list of information is
stored, and if it can be relocated. Not to mention the shortcuts
at the root level, which are not listed in either place.

The library database for WMP 11 is located at:

%LOCALAPPDATA%\Microsoft\Media Player

I don't know if or how the database might be moved.

 

[Ken Springer]

I don't think there's an easy way to move the libraries themselves
(maybe some kind of registry edit would be necessary). You can however
easily move the real locations of the folders in those libraries. I
like libraries but I keep nothing stored on the c drive other than the
operating system & programs. While Documents, Downloads, Music, &
Pictures, are all sections in Libraries, the actual folders & files
reside on another hard drive. (My browser's Favorites folder also
resides on another drive.)

Getting her stuff somewhere other than C:\ is the goal. We work on it
when we can.


--
Ken

Mac OS X 10.8.2
Firefox 19.0
Thunderbird 17.0.3
LibreOffice 3.6.5.2

 

[Mike Barnes]

I ignore libraries.

Same here. I looked at Libraries when W7 arrived and thought "what's the
point?". That's a question I still haven't been able to answer. The
nearest I can come to an answer is that they're designed for people
whose brains work a different way from mine. I have files in folders
and... well, that's it. Why make it more complicated?

 

[mick]

Same here. I looked at Libraries when W7 arrived and thought "what's the
point?". That's a question I still haven't been able to answer. The
nearest I can come to an answer is that they're designed for people
whose brains work a different way from mine. I have files in folders
and... well, that's it. Why make it more complicated?

+1

 

[Jeff Layman]

http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/magazine/dd861346.aspx

"A library in Windows 7 is stored as an XML definition
file that has a file extension of .library-ms."

I don't know if that'll help, but it might be a start.
At least it doesn't use the registry.

Interesting. Agent Ransack find all the library-ms folders at
C:\Users\{username]\AppData\Roaming\Microsoft\Windows\Libraries (except
for "Recorded TV" which is at C:\Users\Public\Libraries).

Are those AppData folders real folders or specialised ones? If you
right-click on "Libraries" as a sub-folder of Desktop in Windows
Explorer, there are several options, but there is no "Properties".
Similarly, if any of the actual library sub-folders is right-clicked,
"Properties" appears, but clicking on that only gets one tab -
"Library". Contrast that with
C:\Users\{username]\AppData\Roaming\Microsoft\Windows\Libraries, where
right-clicking gives the usual extensive options. That includes
Properties | Security, where "Special Permissions" is not ticked. I
wonder if it would be possible to get rid of libraries completely by
getting full control of those folders? I believe that, even if you
delete them, Win7 recreates them at boot.

 

[Paul]

http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/magazine/dd861346.aspx

"A library in Windows 7 is stored as an XML definition
file that has a file extension of .library-ms."

I don't know if that'll help, but it might be a start.
At least it doesn't use the registry.

Interesting. Agent Ransack find all the library-ms folders at
C:\Users\{username]\AppData\Roaming\Microsoft\Windows\Libraries (except
for "Recorded TV" which is at C:\Users\Public\Libraries).

Are those AppData folders real folders or specialised ones? If you
right-click on "Libraries" as a sub-folder of Desktop in Windows
Explorer, there are several options, but there is no "Properties".
Similarly, if any of the actual library sub-folders is right-clicked,
"Properties" appears, but clicking on that only gets one tab -
"Library". Contrast that with
C:\Users\{username]\AppData\Roaming\Microsoft\Windows\Libraries, where
right-clicking gives the usual extensive options. That includes
Properties | Security, where "Special Permissions" is not ticked. I
wonder if it would be possible to get rid of libraries completely by
getting full control of those folders? I believe that, even if you
delete them, Win7 recreates them at boot.

I have a Windows 7 in a VM right now, and I booted Linux in there, to list
all the files (so "hidden" would not be a problem).

Each library is controlled by a *.library-ms file.

That's how it keeps track of the folders. These are the five files
I was able to find (Win7 SP1).

/Users/username/AppData/Roaming/Microsoft/Windows/Libraries/
Documents.library-ms
Music.library-ms
Pictures.library-ms
Videos.library-ms
/Users/Public/Libraries/
RecordedTV.library-ms

Those files appear to be hidden while I'm in Windows 7 (at
least in Explorer).

I added a couple folders to my "Music" library. The added folders
were on my D: and E: partitions.

If I look in the file "Music.library-ms" (which is an XML text file),

<url>E:\first</url>
...
<url>F:\second</url>

So the two folders I added to Music library, on partitions other
than C:, are now part of the library.

Included in the XML file, is a reference to "@shell32.dll,-34588",
and on the older OSes, that's what causes custom views of things
to be created. So that's the call that checks the XML file, and
decides what to show as "being in that library". Since the libraries
can have different media types, the "-34588" number would be
different for each .library-ms file. That's so music files could
be treated different than video files, when their folder
is being displayed.

A library has a default storage location, and that can be
set to any of the constituent folders (including the
system default before you start adding folders to it).

*******

There's an example of setting the Library here.

http://social.technet.microsoft.com...n/thread/1752b73f-256f-4030-a6b4-75c2b434c1d4

In this picture, they've set the Documents library to a server
of some sort.

http://ajzgnq.blu.livefilestore.com...ESu--LU40VPW7kx/FolderRedirection2.jpg?psid=1

But the actual tracking, of what folders "belong" to the library,
that's an XML text file. It's a list of all the folders. If
you were to move the library, perhaps moving the thing it
defaults to, to another partition, is the best you can do.
If a person adds folders to the library, they're not
actually stored in the library - just made to look like
they are.

In the example I did, I expect if I dropped a music file into
my "music library", it's stored on the default folder for it
on C: (because I didn't change that at all). If I changed
the default folder for such dragging and dropping, to E:\first,
then my storage space on E: gets chewed up.

As near as I can tell, you don't have to move the Library
to another disk. You could change the default storage
location for drag and drop, so any files being dropped
into the library, are sent off to a different partition.

I also notice in the XML file,

<url>knownfolder:{4BD8D571-6D19-48D3-BE97-422220080E43}</url>

Windows uses indirection for some objects, and so I'd look
in the Registry for the "long string thing", to find out
what actual folder that points to. And tracing that backwards,
appears to get rather complicated (there's a whole structure to
walk backwards through).

Better to move it with the GUI I guess

Hmmm. Maybe I can test that.

Paul

 

[Paul]

Ken Springer wrote:
My apologies for the somewhat misleading subject line, but after 10
minutes of pondering, couldn't come up with anything better.

First, yes I'm aware that the actual files/contents of a library are
stored elsewhere, the library is just a list of contents.
Working/dealing with those are the intended subject.

Background:

I'm one that does not believe in having user data on the boot
drive. On
a time available basis, I'm helping a friend of mine relocate the
folders in her user documents to another partition on her laptop hard
drive.

I want to do the same with Library data, but so far web searches have
been of no value, or the article is actually talking about the actual
documents and folders, not the "library" entries you see when you
open a
library in Windows Explorer.

Somewhere, there has to be a file or something that records what the
contents of a library are, be it folders, files, or shortcuts.

I'm looking for the data that lists the folders and shortcuts contained
in any library. I want to relocate that information to another
partition as well as any user created library. That way, should the OS
need to be reinstalled, the libraries do not have to be rebuilt. A
restore from a System Image should contain the information on where the
library contents are now stored, similar to the users documents.

This obviously needs to include user created documents.

Suggestions? Questions?


http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/magazine/dd861346.aspx

"A library in Windows 7 is stored as an XML definition
file that has a file extension of .library-ms."

I don't know if that'll help, but it might be a start.
At least it doesn't use the registry.

Interesting. Agent Ransack find all the library-ms folders at
C:\Users\{username]\AppData\Roaming\Microsoft\Windows\Libraries
(except for "Recorded TV" which is at C:\Users\Public\Libraries).

Are those AppData folders real folders or specialised ones? If you
right-click on "Libraries" as a sub-folder of Desktop in Windows
Explorer, there are several options, but there is no "Properties".
Similarly, if any of the actual library sub-folders is right-clicked,
"Properties" appears, but clicking on that only gets one tab -
"Library". Contrast that with
C:\Users\{username]\AppData\Roaming\Microsoft\Windows\Libraries, where
right-clicking gives the usual extensive options. That includes
Properties | Security, where "Special Permissions" is not ticked. I
wonder if it would be possible to get rid of libraries completely by
getting full control of those folders? I believe that, even if you
delete them, Win7 recreates them at boot.

Better to move it with the GUI I guess

Hmmm. Maybe I can test that.

Paul

OK, I see what they've done.

http://ajzgnq.blu.livefilestore.com...ESu--LU40VPW7kx/FolderRedirection2.jpg?psid=1

They deleted the line that says something like:

My Music (C:\users\username)

and then added a folder like

External Music (G:\musicfolder)

and then made G:\musicfolder the default and moved
the tick mark next to it. That would be so that
items dragged and dropped into the Music Library,
actually end up in G:\musicfolder.

So really, nothing "moved" as such. They just
arranged their list of folders to include a folder
on an external storage device, then moved the
tick next to that item. The other folders still
actually store their files on their respective
partitions.

And that hardly "forces" all the storage to
be G:\musicfolder. If a person lazily adds
C:\users\username\somefolder to the Music Library,
then that storage is still on C:, and that's a problem.

And the file that keeps the list of folders, is still

\Users\username\AppData\Roaming\Microsoft\Windows\Libraries\Music.library-ms

(The reason I get my forward and backward slashes mixed up,
is I keep alternating between Windows and Linux, to look
at what is going on )

Paul

 

[Gene E. Bloch]

You can also drag a file from another
location to the root level of the library, and Win7 now makes a copy at
the root level. Now, you have two copies of a single file, taking up
more hard drive space.

And if it's a file you might edit, then which copy gets the changes?

Clearly Windows can mess you up when it does that...

 

[Ken Springer]

And if it's a file you might edit, then which copy gets the changes?

Clearly Windows can mess you up when it does that...

I thought of the exact same thing, and mentioned it to my friend early
this morning. It's something I have to put on my todo list, do a lot of
file moving, copying, editing, to find out exactly what Win7 will do
with it.


--
Ken

Mac OS X 10.8.2
Firefox 19.0
Thunderbird 17.0.3
LibreOffice 3.6.5.2

 

[Ken Springer]

So if you move the actual files to another location, does Windows
automatically update the library, or do you have to do it manually?

Excellent question. I don't know, but I've added it to a list of
questions of what happens to files. While the usual answers are
correct, as I work with libraries to answer my questions about them, I'm
finding the standard answers to not be in depth enough for my curiosity.



--
Ken

Mac OS X 10.8.2
Firefox 19.0
Thunderbird 17.0.3
LibreOffice 3.6.5.2

 

[Gene E. Bloch]

I thought of the exact same thing, and mentioned it to my friend early
this morning. It's something I have to put on my todo list, do a lot of
file moving, copying, editing, to find out exactly what Win7 will do
with it.

A definite PITA.

I'm reminded of a trick I learned when I used Unix in the pre-GUI days.

I was frequently working in subshells, and also frequently losing
changes I'd made to files I was editing.

It took me forever to figure out that I sometimes had several sessions
open on a given file, and that I was saving it from an unchanged session
*after* saving my latest changes elsewhere.

I said it was a trick that I had learned. I didn't say it was a trick
that I *knew* I had learned

 

[Ken Springer]

Same here. I looked at Libraries when W7 arrived and thought "what's the
point?". That's a question I still haven't been able to answer. The
nearest I can come to an answer is that they're designed for people
whose brains work a different way from mine. I have files in folders
and... well, that's it. Why make it more complicated?

It depends on how you use them, from what I can tell.

To me, MS has misused the word "libraries". A practice they have been
known to do in the past.

It seems to me, the way MS has implemented the library process better
fits people who know little to nothing about hard drive organization,
and even less about keeping the user data out of the boot partition(s).
A library simply becomes a list of folders, under the general heading
of libraries, of similar types of data. One for documents, one for
family photos, one for vacation photos, etc. More or less as the
default sub-libraries currently are in a default installation.

Here's the problem I see with that. What if, in a particular folder,
you have a mixed bag of files. Some are music, some are documents, some
are photos, etc. Which library do you put this folder in? Yes, you can
have that folder displayed in each library, but do you really want your
photos and music files to be listed in the documents library? I
wouldn't. They're not documents.

Done the way MS has it (apparently) set up, does seem useless,
redundant, complicated, and not necessary, to me.

I'm experimenting with an idea of how to view and use libraries
differently, but I'm somewhat sure it's not going to work. If it does,
I'll post here about it.


--
Ken

Mac OS X 10.8.2
Firefox 19.0
Thunderbird 17.0.3
LibreOffice 3.6.5.2