Securing files from IT

A

Allen Drake

This isn't a computer issue.

Just make an appointment with the guy, have him install while you're
there and take it back.
It would be nice if it were just that easy. I have no way of knowing
if he will allow me to make an appointment or tell me it will take
awhile and to pick it up at the end of the day when I show up at an
agreed time. My post was very much about computers and security and
Windows 7 in general. The way things seem to work at this place is
before anything even gets started one must first have a cup of coffee
and shoot the breeze. Make a few calls, chit-chat about this and that,
have another cup and break for lunch. It has been two weeks and
counting since I got my photo taken for my badge. The whole company
is in the process of expanding to a second building and setting up new
office space. I have been trying to meet with HR to discuss benefits
for weeks and enroll in their insurance and so on. Everyone is on
salary and take breaks to work out in the gym. Do you want to know who
has the best golf score? I bet I can get that data before first break.
Did I mention "Laid Back" in a previous post?
 
J

J. P. Gilliver (John)

In message <[email protected]>, Allen Drake
It would be nice if it were just that easy. I have no way of knowing
if he will allow me to make an appointment or tell me it will take
awhile and to pick it up at the end of the day when I show up at an
agreed time. My post was very much about computers and security and
Windows 7 in general. The way things seem to work at this place is
before anything even gets started one must first have a cup of coffee
and shoot the breeze. Make a few calls, chit-chat about this and that,
have another cup and break for lunch. It has been two weeks and
counting since I got my photo taken for my badge. The whole company
is in the process of expanding to a second building and setting up new
office space. I have been trying to meet with HR to discuss benefits
for weeks and enroll in their insurance and so on. Everyone is on
salary and take breaks to work out in the gym. Do you want to know who
has the best golf score? I bet I can get that data before first break.
Did I mention "Laid Back" in a previous post?
Hmm. It sounds as if you're not too happy with the laid-backness, but it
might just be a matter of getting used to it.

Can you give any hint as to the name of this company - or is it a small
one we mostly won't have heard of?
 
A

Allen Drake

In message <[email protected]>, Allen Drake

Hmm. It sounds as if you're not too happy with the laid-backness, but it
might just be a matter of getting used to it.

Can you give any hint as to the name of this company - or is it a small
one we mostly won't have heard of?
I am very happy to say the least. You are right, it will take some
getting used to. I am not sure it I dare disclose the company name.
The more people use the Internet the smaller it becomes. It is a small
company that I am sure not many have heard of but it is owned by a
very large corporation.

Al.
 
C

charlie

Allen Drake wrote:

For the first time ever I will need to allow someone to have access
to my laptop. IT will be installing CAD applications and I espacially
don't want anyone to have access to my files in Outlook 2010 and other
files to numerous to even consider.

Can I get some opinions on a good way to at least password protect
Outlook? I assume Administrator rights will be needed to install
applications. I have never set up accounts as I am the only one that
has ever use any of my systems. Can I set up a limited account for IT
use that will block everything but what they need to do?

Thanks for any suggestions.

Al.

IT already has access to your Outlook files if you are using Exchange as
your mail server. Since you say "IT" then your workstation is in some
corporate network setup and it's likely they are using Exchange. You
only have a *copy* of what is in your mailbox up on their Exchange
server. Also, it is highly likely that they already monitor their
network traffic so anything within your e-mails, even those that come
from an outside e-mail provider (Hotmail, Gmail, etc), can be
interrogated for keywords and recorded. Also remember that all that
Outlook data is *their* property, not yours. You are using their
property: their workstation, their network, their mail servers, their
software. Plus you are supposed to be working for them when you are at
work. Thay may even have installed a [hidden] client on your host to
assist in backing up all their workstations. They can walk over to your
host, logon as Administrator, and take ownership of all your files. If
you thought they didn't have or couldn't get at that data, you're wrong.

You won't protect your mailbox data on their Exchange server. You can't
be sure what they sniffed out on *their* network while you were using
*their* computer. At best, you can use an encryption tool, like
TrueCrypt, to store your other data files that you don't want them to
see. However, some companies have policies that you cannot secrete any
files on *their* property without their permission and without their
availability to access; else, they'll just delete it, especially if they
just reimage your HDD with their sysprep image when you call for help
and that's the quickest way to get you back to doing your work.

By your question, it looks like you don't even have admin privileges on
your host. You login to their network domain using the account they
gave you which assigns you the privileges they choose to give you. At
best, you may be granted a login that gives you admin privs on just that
host alone (but that requires manual configuration and often the IT
folks aren't willing to work with an individual and instead assign
accounts and their privs in "groups" so you belong to a group that
regulates what privs you get). If, for example, you worked in a Dev or
QA group, then you need admin privs but your domain account will give
them only to that host, not any others. Yet the sysadmins will still
have full privileges on your host and can do anything you can do as an
admin.

Forget about hiding your e-mails. They already have that data on their
Exchange server or by sniffing their network traffic. For that other,
um, "personal stuff" either consider removing it from their property or
hide it in an encrypted container (e.g., TrueCrypt and BestCrypt
Portable are free). Of course, that assumes that they aren't running
keyloggers or data miners on *their* property to monitor what their
employees are doing.

If you don't want them finding those data files on their property and
possibly looking inside, don't put them there (on their workstations or
transferred across their network).

Let me make this easier. My laptop that will soon have Solid Works
installed is my private computer not in any way monitored or
controlled by the IT department. Different from the network I am on
while on company property. One other option I have is to install the
application myself in my home. I have been given that option but it is
taking longer than I expected to get the disks. I was considering the
install be done if I wanted to bring my laptop to work. If and when I
decided to do this is what prompted me to this post for advice after
searching for a way to PW protect Outlook 2010. I don't use exchange.
Only Solid works, MasterCam, AutoCad and a few other design SW most in
the privacy of my own home. I might voluntarily bring a drawing home
to complete or modify rather than stay on the job.

It's just that simple.
I guess that it depends on how much you can rely on the IT people to
just install the CAD/CAM software and nothing else.

I'd likely take the laptop to work, go to the IT department, get them to
hand me the install disks, and do it myself.

Lets just say that I'm retired, and no longer have to deal with company
or govt. IT groups. In my years working with minicomps and then P/Cs,
The IT departments went from (If it's not a mainframe, we don't want
anything to do with it!) to (We control Everything, or else!)

The latter gets really funny when you are dealing with a P/C or similar
computer that is used to control banks of instrumentation and equipment.
Thee IT people usually take one look, and eventually say something to
the effect that you can do whatever you want. It can get a bit sticky
when that includes LAN/WAN access without the IT's favorite software.
Obviously you have the years and experience I will never have and I
respect your wealth of knowledge. I plan on never retiring before the
dirt nap. I just having way to much fun above ground.

Al.
As to retirement - -
Unfortunately, my time in the Vietnam Era Navy (in Vietnam no less!)
came back to haunt me with the usual problems. Non retirement was not
an option, unfortunately. Given the present job situation faced by many,
I'm glad to be out of the rat race.

Just one of my more amusing minor "fights" with the IT people involved
(of all things) a fairly fancy HP Laser printer. It was shown as a
computer related peripheral, so a DOD/USAF IT department supposedly had
the say as to what you could buy, etc. The printer was intended to
connect to a software development system, and to be used to print
graphics as well as the usual text, some of which was classified at a
low level. (Totally outside of the IT department's domain and bailiwick)

What happened was that the printer model was brand new, and we had
"borrowed" an engineering unit from HP to prove that it could do what
was needed. Next, the funding had nothing to do with the IT department,
and convincing them and the purchasing people was a drawn out battle.
(The purchasing people were trying to gain control of the funding, so
they could spend it on their computer systems.)

When all was said and done, we got the printers about six months later
than we should have. The cause was that the purchasing and the IT
departments forced us to get the printer model "stock listed".
When the stock number was finally issued, DOD IT ordered the entire
first production run. They ended up paying a few hundred more than
they might have had to, since the stock listed version had options that
were fairly unique to our application and some power plants, and not
needed for the usual computer related applications.
 
C

charlie

That's the way I had it figured and when you get right down to it I
really don't have anything to hide other then simple personal data
like bank statements and purchase orders. Birth certificates the usual
things people keep on computers. However I would never return a HDD
for warrantee replacement. I have every one I have ever owned since
the first PC running Windows 3.0. Lets see, that must be a bit over
several dozen I guess.

Al.
In the 1980's and 90's, we were required to physically destroy HDD's
with a sledge hammer, then run them through a crusher/shredder.
(Even though there was an "approved" way to remove the date from the
drives.) Security would only permit us to use the approved data removal
procedures when the HDD's were going to be reused within the same group
for a similar purpose.
 
C

charlie

if you want anything
done the way you want it is to do it yourself.
Isn't that usually the case?
The real problem is remembering exactly what you did so that you can
repeat it some time later.
 
A

Allen Drake

In the 1980's and 90's, we were required to physically destroy HDD's
with a sledge hammer, then run them through a crusher/shredder.
(Even though there was an "approved" way to remove the date from the
drives.) Security would only permit us to use the approved data removal
procedures when the HDD's were going to be reused within the same group
for a similar purpose.
It seems the people demanding this had no idea of the workings of the
devices. I can think of many other ways to destroy the platters. Was
this idea unique to your organization devised by one person perhaps?
 
A

Allen Drake

Isn't that usually the case?
The real problem is remembering exactly what you did so that you can
repeat it some time later.
Isn't that why they were invented in the first place? So no one
would have to remember anything? Or do anything while the computer did
all the daily work and chores?
 
A

Allen Drake

On 10/1/2011 7:38 PM, Allen Drake wrote:

Allen Drake wrote:

For the first time ever I will need to allow someone to have access
to my laptop. IT will be installing CAD applications and I espacially
don't want anyone to have access to my files in Outlook 2010 and other
files to numerous to even consider.

Can I get some opinions on a good way to at least password protect
Outlook? I assume Administrator rights will be needed to install
applications. I have never set up accounts as I am the only one that
has ever use any of my systems. Can I set up a limited account for IT
use that will block everything but what they need to do?

Thanks for any suggestions.

Al.

IT already has access to your Outlook files if you are using Exchange as
your mail server. Since you say "IT" then your workstation is in some
corporate network setup and it's likely they are using Exchange. You
only have a *copy* of what is in your mailbox up on their Exchange
server. Also, it is highly likely that they already monitor their
network traffic so anything within your e-mails, even those that come
from an outside e-mail provider (Hotmail, Gmail, etc), can be
interrogated for keywords and recorded. Also remember that all that
Outlook data is *their* property, not yours. You are using their
property: their workstation, their network, their mail servers, their
software. Plus you are supposed to be working for them when you are at
work. Thay may even have installed a [hidden] client on your host to
assist in backing up all their workstations. They can walk over to your
host, logon as Administrator, and take ownership of all your files. If
you thought they didn't have or couldn't get at that data, you're wrong.

You won't protect your mailbox data on their Exchange server. You can't
be sure what they sniffed out on *their* network while you were using
*their* computer. At best, you can use an encryption tool, like
TrueCrypt, to store your other data files that you don't want them to
see. However, some companies have policies that you cannot secrete any
files on *their* property without their permission and without their
availability to access; else, they'll just delete it, especially if they
just reimage your HDD with their sysprep image when you call for help
and that's the quickest way to get you back to doing your work.

By your question, it looks like you don't even have admin privileges on
your host. You login to their network domain using the account they
gave you which assigns you the privileges they choose to give you. At
best, you may be granted a login that gives you admin privs on just that
host alone (but that requires manual configuration and often the IT
folks aren't willing to work with an individual and instead assign
accounts and their privs in "groups" so you belong to a group that
regulates what privs you get). If, for example, you worked in a Dev or
QA group, then you need admin privs but your domain account will give
them only to that host, not any others. Yet the sysadmins will still
have full privileges on your host and can do anything you can do as an
admin.

Forget about hiding your e-mails. They already have that data on their
Exchange server or by sniffing their network traffic. For that other,
um, "personal stuff" either consider removing it from their property or
hide it in an encrypted container (e.g., TrueCrypt and BestCrypt
Portable are free). Of course, that assumes that they aren't running
keyloggers or data miners on *their* property to monitor what their
employees are doing.

If you don't want them finding those data files on their property and
possibly looking inside, don't put them there (on their workstations or
transferred across their network).

Let me make this easier. My laptop that will soon have Solid Works
installed is my private computer not in any way monitored or
controlled by the IT department. Different from the network I am on
while on company property. One other option I have is to install the
application myself in my home. I have been given that option but it is
taking longer than I expected to get the disks. I was considering the
install be done if I wanted to bring my laptop to work. If and when I
decided to do this is what prompted me to this post for advice after
searching for a way to PW protect Outlook 2010. I don't use exchange.
Only Solid works, MasterCam, AutoCad and a few other design SW most in
the privacy of my own home. I might voluntarily bring a drawing home
to complete or modify rather than stay on the job.

It's just that simple.

I guess that it depends on how much you can rely on the IT people to
just install the CAD/CAM software and nothing else.

I'd likely take the laptop to work, go to the IT department, get them to
hand me the install disks, and do it myself.

Lets just say that I'm retired, and no longer have to deal with company
or govt. IT groups. In my years working with minicomps and then P/Cs,
The IT departments went from (If it's not a mainframe, we don't want
anything to do with it!) to (We control Everything, or else!)

The latter gets really funny when you are dealing with a P/C or similar
computer that is used to control banks of instrumentation and equipment.
Thee IT people usually take one look, and eventually say something to
the effect that you can do whatever you want. It can get a bit sticky
when that includes LAN/WAN access without the IT's favorite software.
Obviously you have the years and experience I will never have and I
respect your wealth of knowledge. I plan on never retiring before the
dirt nap. I just having way to much fun above ground.

Al.
As to retirement - -
Unfortunately, my time in the Vietnam Era Navy (in Vietnam no less!)
came back to haunt me with the usual problems. Non retirement was not
an option, unfortunately. Given the present job situation faced by many,
I'm glad to be out of the rat race.

Just one of my more amusing minor "fights" with the IT people involved
(of all things) a fairly fancy HP Laser printer. It was shown as a
computer related peripheral, so a DOD/USAF IT department supposedly had
the say as to what you could buy, etc. The printer was intended to
connect to a software development system, and to be used to print
graphics as well as the usual text, some of which was classified at a
low level. (Totally outside of the IT department's domain and bailiwick)

What happened was that the printer model was brand new, and we had
"borrowed" an engineering unit from HP to prove that it could do what
was needed. Next, the funding had nothing to do with the IT department,
and convincing them and the purchasing people was a drawn out battle.
(The purchasing people were trying to gain control of the funding, so
they could spend it on their computer systems.)

When all was said and done, we got the printers about six months later
than we should have. The cause was that the purchasing and the IT
departments forced us to get the printer model "stock listed".
When the stock number was finally issued, DOD IT ordered the entire
first production run. They ended up paying a few hundred more than
they might have had to, since the stock listed version had options that
were fairly unique to our application and some power plants, and not
needed for the usual computer related applications.
Interesting.

I did my time perhaps the same time you were serving but I was not in
a war zone so I consider myself lucky. I am very familiar with
military activity in the manor you mention. I had nothing to do with
computers and don't even remember their place in the late 60's when I
was separated. We sure have come a long way in the past 50 years.

Regards.

Al.
 
K

Ken Blake

Isn't that why they were invented in the first place? So no one
would have to remember anything? Or do anything while the computer did
all the daily work and chores?


I can't remember why they were invented.
 
G

Gene E. Bloch

As posted I repeat my remarks. I am not required to work at home. I
have all the tools I need at my job site. It seems what I have is far
beyond the range of a few in this group. Sad.
I'm pleased that you so graciously accept the attempts of people here to
voluntarily help you.
 
J

J. P. Gilliver (John)

Allen Drake said:
On Sun, 2 Oct 2011 21:25:37 +0100, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"


I am very happy to say the least. You are right, it will take some
getting used to. I am not sure it I dare disclose the company name.
The more people use the Internet the smaller it becomes. It is a small
company that I am sure not many have heard of but it is owned by a
very large corporation.

Al.
Glad you're happy. The laid-backness does sound attractive - are they
recruiting (-:? (Though I fear you're in USA - I'm UK - so less so.)
 
J

J. P. Gilliver (John)

In message <[email protected]>, Allen Drake
It seems the people demanding this had no idea of the workings of the
devices. I can think of many other ways to destroy the platters. Was
this idea unique to your organization devised by one person perhaps?
By no means. I've seen at our place a drill being put through them, as
well as (not sure if on the same occasion) hammers used; certainly
physical destruction was quite commonly called for at lots of
organisations. They all do seem to be overkill - a proper DoD-approved
data erasure method (basically multiple overwriting with assorted
patterns, some of them random) makes it pretty impossible to retrieve
anything, and leaves a usable item.
 
A

Allen Drake

Glad you're happy. The laid-backness does sound attractive - are they
recruiting (-:? (Though I fear you're in USA - I'm UK - so less so.)
I have no idea if they are looking to hire. They don't tell me much.
They have a plant somewhere in the South of the US. I don't know about
the UK.
 
A

Allen Drake

In message <[email protected]>, Allen Drake

By no means. I've seen at our place a drill being put through them, as
well as (not sure if on the same occasion) hammers used; certainly
physical destruction was quite commonly called for at lots of
organisations. They all do seem to be overkill - a proper DoD-approved
data erasure method (basically multiple overwriting with assorted
patterns, some of them random) makes it pretty impossible to retrieve
anything, and leaves a usable item.

I think we have finally seen the end of the hard drive anyway. Thank
goodness.
 
M

Mortimer

J. P. Gilliver (John) said:
In message <[email protected]>, Allen Drake

By no means. I've seen at our place a drill being put through them, as
well as (not sure if on the same occasion) hammers used; certainly
physical destruction was quite commonly called for at lots of
organisations. They all do seem to be overkill - a proper DoD-approved
data erasure method (basically multiple overwriting with assorted
patterns, some of them random) makes it pretty impossible to retrieve
anything, and leaves a usable item.
I 've heard it said that some MOD departments require the data-removal
company to dismantle the disk, shave the oxide off the platters and then
(wait for it) return the oxide to the MOD. Who would have the patience to
assumble all the oxide particles into the correct place on each platter to
reconstruct the data :)
 
J

J. P. Gilliver (John)

In message <[email protected]>, Allen Drake
I think we have finally seen the end of the hard drive anyway. Thank
goodness.
I don't think so, for some time at least! Other methods are indeed
taking over for smaller quantities of data, but with people's
ever-growing appetite for it (and industry's ability to generate
ever-hungrier formats - it's been video for the last few years, I wonder
what'll come along that's hungrier than HD video ...), I don't see the
HD stopping any time soon.
 
A

Allen Drake

In message <[email protected]>, Allen Drake


I don't think so, for some time at least! Other methods are indeed
taking over for smaller quantities of data, but with people's
ever-growing appetite for it (and industry's ability to generate
ever-hungrier formats - it's been video for the last few years, I wonder
what'll come along that's hungrier than HD video ...), I don't see the
HD stopping any time soon.
You are right. After I posted that I re-thought what I had stated and
would revise that to say "the beginning of the end". I think it will
be like many other forms of media storage devices such as the music
CD. I still have audio cassette drives stashed away because they are
in mint condition still in the boxes. When the SSDs come down in price
what will that do to the already very cheap HDD? I have already
replaced four of them in as many systems. Who would ever have an HDD
in a new laptop? The heat alone and as soon as they start using faster
sata 3 motherboards I know I will never use one again. I know the
battery life has increased but I haven had time to test that
advantage.

Al.
 

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