Backups to the cloud

[Mark F]

I use the scheduler built into Acronis True Image to make a full
backup every other week, with a second task that makes a full backup
every week in between the first task. The result is that I get a new
full backup every week. I have to automate it or it won't get done.

Please note that it is impossible to do a full consistent backup of
a Windows system while it is running.

It is theoretically possible to do a backup of the exact state of the
disk, but the data on the disk is not guaranteed to be in a consistent
state, or even a state that can be booted from.

In the past I have tried older versions of several commercial
products, including those mentioned in this group
(alt.windows7.general) and alt.backup-software, but none of
them even managed to do even a backup of the state of the
disk either at the start of the end of the backup. Perhaps the
current version of one or more of the products can now make a
copy of the current state of the disk, but, as mentioned above, this
may not be consistent or even bootable.

 

[Char Jackson]

Please note that it is impossible to do a full consistent backup of
a Windows system while it is running.

It is theoretically possible to do a backup of the exact state of the
disk, but the data on the disk is not guaranteed to be in a consistent
state, or even a state that can be booted from.

In the past I have tried older versions of several commercial
products, including those mentioned in this group
(alt.windows7.general) and alt.backup-software, but none of
them even managed to do even a backup of the state of the
disk either at the start of the end of the backup. Perhaps the
current version of one or more of the products can now make a
copy of the current state of the disk, but, as mentioned above, this
may not be consistent or even bootable.

I've never had the problems you describe, which might only indicate
that I've been fortunate, but the fact that you say you've never had a
full success leads me to believe that your system has other issues.

 

[Gene E. Bloch]

I've never had the problems you describe, which might only indicate
that I've been fortunate, but the fact that you say you've never had a
full success leads me to believe that your system has other issues.

AFAIK, modern backup programs use the Shadow Copy facility to create an
image that is consistent at the (approximate) moment the backup is
started, and use that to create a consistent image.

But maybe I should research that, or do an experiment, to see if I
continue to agree with myself.

 

[Mark F]

AFAIK, modern backup programs use the Shadow Copy facility to create an
image that is consistent at the (approximate) moment the backup is
started, and use that to create a consistent image.

I used at least 3 versions of each product and things failed to work
with due to problems that I encountered, as contrasted with the
theoretical of the clones being clones of a consistent disk image.

It has been more than 5 years (maybe more than 9 years) since I tried
cloning live systems, so all of the products have been updated many
times and might seem to work correctly in many cases.

However, the underlying issue is that the data on the disk is not
guaranteed to be in a valid state. Shadow Copy might ensure that
the clone is a copy of the data on the disk at some point in time,
but the data on the disk might not be consistent.

Some reasons why not:
1. the partitions are marked active unless the clone program
addresses that issue
2. There might be information that hasn't been written to the
disk yet. (Keeping the metadata on the disk in synch with the
real metadata in the running system just handles metadata issues
and hides the fact that programs think data was written to the
disk but the data hasn't yet been written. The existence of
database programs that are aware of what is actually happening
doesn't mean that ALL programs handle this issue.)
3. In many cases consistency is required between multiple files
but no attempt is made to keep things consistent until the
program exists. Sometimes when you try to run from the
clone you get strange errors that ultimately were because the
disk clone was not consistent. Sometimes the clone is consistent,
but operations that seemed complete to the user haven't been
written to the clone.
4. I'm sure that Windows itself has many clear cases of 2 and 3, but
it probably also messes around with eleventy-eight other things
for the Registry that mean 2 or 3 apply even though the
user hasn't changed anything.

 

[Char Jackson]

I used at least 3 versions of each product and things failed to work
with due to problems that I encountered, as contrasted with the
theoretical of the clones being clones of a consistent disk image.

It has been more than 5 years (maybe more than 9 years) since I tried
cloning live systems, so all of the products have been updated many
times and might seem to work correctly in many cases.

I mean no offense whatsoever, but is it possible that your 5-9 year
old experience might no longer be relevant? I'm not saying things are
perfect in backupland, but I've personally seen exactly zero of the
issues you describe below.

 

[Twayne]

In

AFAIK, modern backup programs use the Shadow Copy
facility to create an image that is consistent at the
(approximate) moment the backup is started, and use that
to create a consistent image.

But maybe I should research that, or do an experiment, to
see if I continue to agree with myself.

Yes, you are corrrect IME.
It sounds like Volume Shadow Copy Service (VSS) might not be running. The OP
should Verify that it runs after starting Acronis and before sending out any
backups.
Will a backup to C (boot disk) work? Then VSS services are running.

If above is true, then something about the cloud requirements might be
getting in the way, but I think VSS not running is more likely the problem.
VSS takes a snapshot of the related files to go along with the image and the
image WILL be bootable upon redownloading.
If the OP does an online search for VSS ofr volume shadow copy service he
should find plenty of information that explains how/why it has to be running
to back up an operating system.
I've been using it on win7 with no problems. I don't have time to check
out all the keyclicks, but I've used it with Norton Backup.