Upgrading old computers

[Antares 531]

We have two old desktop computers in our household network that are on
the verge of obsolescence, but I would like to upgrade them. Both are
still running Windows XP but I'm not sure the CPUs and the motherboard
in general is capable of handling a later version...say Windows 7, 64
bit.

How can I determine the upgrade limitations for these old computers
before I buy any new hard disks or software for them?

If these computers are upgradable, can I install a new hard drive then
format it for 64 bits, then install Windows 7, then use the old files
that are now stored on a second hard drive that is formatted for 32
bit data?

 

[s|b]

We have two old desktop computers in our household network that are on
the verge of obsolescence, but I would like to upgrade them. Both are
still running Windows XP but I'm not sure the CPUs and the motherboard
in general is capable of handling a later version...say Windows 7, 64
bit.

IMHO you'd be better off with a complete new system. I gave my old XP
system to my godchild and bought a new one with W7 HP.

If this isn't an option, then check if your system(s) can support a SSD.
If you install your OS on an SSD it will greatly improve your speed.

How can I determine the upgrade limitations for these old computers
before I buy any new hard disks or software for them?

<http://lmgtfy.com/?q=how+to+check+windows+7+compatibility>

Second link leads to Windows 7 Upgrade Advisor.

If these computers are upgradable, can I install a new hard drive then
format it for 64 bits,

You don't need to format them for 64-bits. NTFS will suffice. The
question is: does your motherboard/CPU support 64-bit?

then install Windows 7, then use the old files
that are now stored on a second hard drive that is formatted for 32
bit data?

This isn't a problem; AFAIK you can't format for 32 or 64-bits.

 

[Andy Burns]

We have two old desktop computers in our household network that are on
the verge of obsolescence, but I would like to upgrade them. Both are
still running Windows XP but I'm not sure the CPUs and the motherboard
in general is capable of handling a later version...say Windows 7, 64
bit.

Something like http://www.cpuid.com/softwares/hwmonitor-pro.html
will tell you whether you have 64 bit capable CPU.

But how much memory do you have, and can you take, there's limited
benefit of 64bit Win7 unless the machine has (or can accept later) more
than 4GB memory

Do you have SATA hard drives, or older IDE ones, they might be on their
last legs.

Beware that if they really are *too* old you'd be better of spending on
all new hardware rather than upgrades to old kit that don't give you the
full benefit

How can I determine the upgrade limitations for these old computers
before I buy any new hard disks or software for them?

If these computers are upgradable, can I install a new hard drive then
format it for 64 bits, then install Windows 7, then use the old files
that are now stored on a second hard drive that is formatted for 32
bit data?

The hard drive format doesn't vary for 32 or 64 bit windows, so yes you
could use your existing system disc as a data disc.

 

[Andy Burns]

Something like http://www.cpuid.com/softwares/hwmonitor-pro.html
will tell you whether you have 64 bit capable CPU.

Sorry that's the link to the pro software, the free one is at
http://www.cpuid.com/softwares/cpu-z.html

 

[John Williamson]

We have two old desktop computers in our household network that are on
the verge of obsolescence, but I would like to upgrade them. Both are
still running Windows XP but I'm not sure the CPUs and the motherboard
in general is capable of handling a later version...say Windows 7, 64
bit.

How can I determine the upgrade limitations for these old computers
before I buy any new hard disks or software for them?

If these computers are upgradable, can I install a new hard drive then
format it for 64 bits, then install Windows 7, then use the old files
that are now stored on a second hard drive that is formatted for 32
bit data?

The *minimum* for Windows 7 is a 1GHz processor and a Gig of RAM, as
well as some ridiculous amount of HD space. (15 Gig?) This will sort of
run it, but definitely without Aero.

For 64bit, you need a genuine dual core processor or better.

http://windows.microsoft.com/en-US/windows/downloads/upgrade-advisor

Tells all. Just download and run it on the machine in question.

http://www.microsoft.com/windows/compatibility/windows-7/en-us/default.aspx

Tells you what else might not work.

 

[Gene E. Bloch]

For 64bit, you need a genuine dual core processor or better.

No, you need a genuine 64-bit processor.

I think today's crop of dual-core processors for Windows might all be 64
bits wide, but there were dual-core 32-bit processors in the old days

Sine the OP admits that his computer is elderly, he could have one of
those.

 

[Wolf K]

We have two old desktop computers in our household network that are on
the verge of obsolescence

How old, exactly? I have a 6-year-old CPU/motherboard in this desktop,
and it's borderline for Win7. It was cutting edge in its day.

but I would like to upgrade them. Both are
still running Windows XP but I'm not sure the CPUs and the motherboard
in general is capable of handling a later version...say Windows 7, 64
bit.

How can I determine the upgrade limitations for these old computers
before I buy any new hard disks or software for them?

Accessories >> System Tools >> System information will tell you about
your hardware. The Summary includes CPU and motherboard information,
which are what you need to know. You can find out more about the
motherboard by entering its model name etc in the google search box.

If the CPU is dual-core, at least 1.5GHz speed, and the motherboard
front side bus runs at 800MHz or better, then you can run Win7, and you
will notice some improvement. If it's any less than that, you may be
able to run W7, but it will hiccup and stumble and generally not perform
as well as it should.

Search on "system information tools freeware" will give you other
options, for example:
http://majorgeeks.com/SIW_System_Info_d4387.html

If these computers are upgradable, can I install a new hard drive then
format it for 64 bits, then install Windows 7, then use the old files
that are now stored on a second hard drive that is formatted for 32
bit data?

32-bit and 64-bit has nothing to do with the HD format. It's a CPU
thing. Win-7 64 bits will not run on a 32-bit CPU.

If the CPU is capable of handling Win7, you will need more RAM. Do _not_
add RAM. Replace the old memory sticks with new ones of higher capacity.
You should have at least 4GB RAM if you want to run Win7. It will run on
less, but not as well.

If you want the old machines just for the basics (e-mail, web, some
writing or spreadsheet, photo viewing & simple processing), then Linux
is a good alternative. I'm using LinuxMint on an 8-year-old laptop, it's
faster than it was with XP.

 

[Antares 531]

We have two old desktop computers in our household network that are on
the verge of obsolescence, but I would like to upgrade them. Both are
still running Windows XP but I'm not sure the CPUs and the motherboard
in general is capable of handling a later version...say Windows 7, 64
bit.

How can I determine the upgrade limitations for these old computers
before I buy any new hard disks or software for them?

If these computers are upgradable, can I install a new hard drive then
format it for 64 bits, then install Windows 7, then use the old files
that are now stored on a second hard drive that is formatted for 32
bit data?

Thanks to each of you for your responses. This pretty well clears up
my questions...I should toss the old computers in the re-cycle bin and
buy replacements. Neither of the old computers would handle 64 bit
software.

My reason for this change is that my new NETGEAR N300 Modem Router
Wi-FI won't connect to either of these older computers. It may be that
I should remove the NETGEAR 64 bit installation software and
re-install it in the 32 bit format.

Gordon

 

[Ken Blake]

We have two old desktop computers in our household network that are on
the verge of obsolescence, but I would like to upgrade them. Both are
still running Windows XP but I'm not sure the CPUs and the motherboard
in general is capable of handling a later version...say Windows 7, 64
bit.

First, it's highly unlikely that such an old computer has
64-bit-capable hardware. But hold down the Windows key and press
Pause|Break. That will tell you what CPU you have and you can look it
up to see if it's a 64-bit one.

Second, it's extremely unlikely that it will make any sense to upgrade
the hardware in such old computers. Almost certainly it will be less
expensive as well as better to simply buy a new computer from someone
like Dell.

How can I determine the upgrade limitations for these old computers
before I buy any new hard disks or software for them?

If these computers are upgradable,

All computers are upgradeable. The issue is not whether it's possible,
the issue is what and how much you have to upgrade, and therefore
whether it makes economic sense to do so.

can I install a new hard drive

Yes.


then
format it for 64 bits,

There is no such thing as "format[ting] for 64 bits." Formatting has
nothing to do with the "bitness" of your CPU or the "bitness" of what
version of Windows you are running.

then install Windows 7,

Yes.


then use the old files

Yes.


that are now stored on a second hard drive that is formatted for 32
bit data?

There is also no such thing as 32-bit data. Data is the same
regardless of the "bitness" of your CPU or the "bitness" of what
version of Windows you are running.

So to summarize, yes, you can do what you want to do. But almost
certainly you should *not*. It's a very bad plan.

 

[Gene E. Bloch]

Thanks to each of you for your responses. This pretty well clears up
my questions...I should toss the old computers in the re-cycle bin and
buy replacements. Neither of the old computers would handle 64 bit
software.

My reason for this change is that my new NETGEAR N300 Modem Router
Wi-FI won't connect to either of these older computers. It may be that
I should remove the NETGEAR 64 bit installation software and
re-install it in the 32 bit format.

Gordon

I agree about the NETGEAR software.

Actually, it surprises me that the 64-bit version would install.

 

[Ken Blake]

The *minimum* for Windows 7 is a 1GHz processor and a Gig of RAM,

The *official* minimum. But for practical purposes, everyone needs at
least 2GB of RAM for adequate performance.

 

[Don Phillipson]

We have two old desktop computers in our household network that are on
the verge of obsolescence, but I would like to upgrade them.
. . .
If these computers are upgradable, can I install a new hard drive then
format it for 64 bits, then install Windows 7, then use the old files
that are now stored on a second hard drive that is formatted for 32
bit data?

Since you have a network, why bother? If they have wireless cards
you can just leave them running and control them remotely from
your Win7 laptop. This is what I do with IBM 8113s (M52) after
adding RAM and Terabyte drives.

 

[Gene E. Bloch]

We have two old desktop computers in our household network that are on
the verge of obsolescence, but I would like to upgrade them. Both are
still running Windows XP but I'm not sure the CPUs and the motherboard
in general is capable of handling a later version...say Windows 7, 64
bit.

First, it's highly unlikely that such an old computer has
64-bit-capable hardware. But hold down the Windows key and press
Pause|Break. That will tell you what CPU you have and you can look it
up to see if it's a 64-bit one.

Second, it's extremely unlikely that it will make any sense to upgrade
the hardware in such old computers. Almost certainly it will be less
expensive as well as better to simply buy a new computer from someone
like Dell.

How can I determine the upgrade limitations for these old computers
before I buy any new hard disks or software for them?

If these computers are upgradable,

All computers are upgradeable. The issue is not whether it's possible,
the issue is what and how much you have to upgrade, and therefore
whether it makes economic sense to do so.

can I install a new hard drive
Yes.

then
format it for 64 bits,

There is no such thing as "format[ting] for 64 bits." Formatting has
nothing to do with the "bitness" of your CPU or the "bitness" of what
version of Windows you are running.

then install Windows 7,
Yes.

then use the old files
Yes.

that are now stored on a second hard drive that is formatted for 32
bit data?

There is also no such thing as 32-bit data. Data is the same
regardless of the "bitness" of your CPU or the "bitness" of what
version of Windows you are running.

So to summarize, yes, you can do what you want to do. But almost
certainly you should *not*. It's a very bad plan.

OK, Ken. It's time to for you to fully accept your word bitness, so go
ahead and drop the quotes.

Or call it data width, word size, or architecture, like most everyone
else does.

To be fair to you (I know, it's not my style!), there really seems to be
no fully established consistent usage. In the past, I have preferred
data width, access width, and similar terms, but I suddenly like the
word architecture that I just ran into on this site:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/64-bit

so I'm thinking I might start to call it 64-bit architecture in the
future. YMMV.

Of course, the above stuff is meant as commentary, not as orders.

 

[Wolf K]

On 23/06/2012 5:56 PM, Antares 531 wrote:
[...]

Thanks to each of you for your responses. This pretty well clears up
my questions...I should toss the old computers in the re-cycle bin and
buy replacements. Neither of the old computers would handle 64 bit
software.

Not really a problem. "64 but software" is not all it's cracked up to
be. Basically, unless it's very CPU intensive (which most software is
definitely not), the difference between 32-bit and 64-bit software is
unnoticeable in everyday use. If the old hardware is fast enough, it's
upgradable.

My reason for this change is that my new NETGEAR N300 Modem Router
Wi-FI won't connect to either of these older computers. It may be that
I should remove the NETGEAR 64 bit installation software and
re-install it in the 32 bit format.

You've got it backwards: the old machines won't connect to wi-fi. If the
old machines have wi-fi capability, you don't need "installation
software". That's needed only to configure the router, ie,, set up the
password, the internet connection, etc. Once the router is configured,
any wi-fi capable device can connect to it, as long as it offers the
correct password (key) when the router requests it. However, because
your machines are old, I doubt they have built-in wi-fi capability.

 

[Antares 531]

I agree about the NETGEAR software.

Actually, it surprises me that the 64-bit version would install.

I installed my NETGEAR modem/router/Wi-Fi setup on my new computer
which has an Intel Cored i7 CPU and 8 GB of RAM. It is running Windows
7 64 bit. That is, this new computer is the "Manager" computer.

The two computers I'm having trouble with are quite old and probably
well beyond any hopes for a reasonable upgrade.

Upon checking things out a bit I find that my laptop is running
Windows Vista 32 bit and it connects with the new NETGEAR setup quite
well. I'm still confused as to why the old computer with the Wi-Fi
setup and the other old computer with a Cat 5 cable hookup won't
connect with the router.

Both of these old computers worked quite well with the old NETGEAR
Wi-Fi/Router/Modem but it was damaged by a lightning strike a few
nights ago and I can't get it to connect to anything using the Cat 5
cables. It still works okay with the Wi-Fi connections but not with
the Cat 5 connections.

Lightning struck a power pole down the street and knocked the power
transformer out. I guess the enormous surge this caused was sufficient
to override my surge protectors and somehow damage the NETGEAR
circuitry some way.

 

[Ken Blake]

I installed my NETGEAR modem/router/Wi-Fi setup on my new computer
which has an Intel Cored i7 CPU and 8 GB of RAM. It is running Windows
7 64 bit. That is, this new computer is the "Manager" computer.

The two computers I'm having trouble with are quite old and probably
well beyond any hopes for a reasonable upgrade.

Again, you can do whatever upgrade you want. Whether it makes economic
sense to it is the real question.

Upon checking things out a bit I find that my laptop is running
Windows Vista 32 bit and it connects with the new NETGEAR setup quite
well. I'm still confused as to why the old computer with the Wi-Fi
setup and the other old computer with a Cat 5 cable hookup won't
connect with the router.

Both of these old computers worked quite well with the old NETGEAR
Wi-Fi/Router/Modem but it was damaged by a lightning strike a few
nights ago and I can't get it to connect to anything using the Cat 5
cables. It still works okay with the Wi-Fi connections but not with
the Cat 5 connections.

Lightning struck a power pole down the street and knocked the power
transformer out. I guess the enormous surge this caused was sufficient
to override my surge protectors and somehow damage the NETGEAR
circuitry some way.

Do you have these $5-15 surge protectors? Despite their names, they
are essentially no more than fancy extension cords. They do next to
nothing to protect you.

If you want a *real* surge protector, you need to buy one of those
that are typically in the $50 -$100 price range.

Moreover, when it comes to thunderstorms, no surge protector provides
real protection. If you have a thunderstorm in your vicinity, you
should power off all your computers, unplug them from the power line,
and disconnect them from their internet connections.

 

[Ken Blake]

OK, Ken. It's time to for you to fully accept your word bitness, so go
ahead and drop the quotes.

LOL! I can't drop the quotes if I use a word that isn't a real
word--one that I made up myself.

Or call it data width, word size, or architecture, like most everyone
else does.

My concern, as always, is that the person I'm replying to understands
what I'm trying to say. Not to disagree that one of those terms might
be better than "bitness," I'm not so sure that they would be as
readily understood.

so I'm thinking I might start to call it 64-bit architecture in the
future. YMMV.

But when I say "bitness" I'm not talking about "64-bit architecture"
but about the various kind of architecture. And if I had said
"Formatting has nothing to do with the architecture of your CPU or the
architecture of what version of Windows you are running," would the OP
have understood what I meant? Maybe, but I'm not so sure. I'm much
more comfortable with my guess that he would understand what I meant
by "bitness."

Of course, the above stuff is meant as commentary, not as orders.

Understood, and no problem. I don't have any problem with your
expressing your opinion, even when it's not the same as mine.

 

[Gene E. Bloch]

I installed my NETGEAR modem/router/Wi-Fi setup on my new computer
which has an Intel Cored i7 CPU and 8 GB of RAM. It is running Windows
7 64 bit. That is, this new computer is the "Manager" computer.

The two computers I'm having trouble with are quite old and probably
well beyond any hopes for a reasonable upgrade.

Upon checking things out a bit I find that my laptop is running
Windows Vista 32 bit and it connects with the new NETGEAR setup quite
well. I'm still confused as to why the old computer with the Wi-Fi
setup and the other old computer with a Cat 5 cable hookup won't
connect with the router.

Both of these old computers worked quite well with the old NETGEAR
Wi-Fi/Router/Modem but it was damaged by a lightning strike a few
nights ago and I can't get it to connect to anything using the Cat 5
cables. It still works okay with the Wi-Fi connections but not with
the Cat 5 connections.

Lightning struck a power pole down the street and knocked the power
transformer out. I guess the enormous surge this caused was sufficient
to override my surge protectors and somehow damage the NETGEAR
circuitry some way.

You have confused me.

Did you mean you installed 64-bit software (drivers, I would guess) in
the old (32-bit) computers or in the new (64-bit) computer?

I thought you meant the former. That's why I was surprised that it
worked. If you meant the latter, what you said seems irrelevant to me -
and I would not expect 32-bit drivers could work there anyway.

I give up for now.

 

[Paul]

For 64bit, you need a genuine dual core processor or better.

My Acer laptop, that shipped with Win7 Premium 64 bit on it,
is a single core running at 2.2GHz or so. Runs fine, until
you get enough background activity (cruft) running.

So they did ship Windows 7 on some relatively crappy hardware

Paul

 

[Gene E. Bloch]

But when I say "bitness" I'm not talking about "64-bit architecture"
but about the various kind of architecture. And if I had said
"Formatting has nothing to do with the architecture of your CPU or the
architecture of what version of Windows you are running," would the OP
have understood what I meant? Maybe, but I'm not so sure. I'm much
more comfortable with my guess that he would understand what I meant
by "bitness."

Well, that's not how I would have worded it.

Everywhere that [architecture] appears above I would have said [64-bit
architecture]. I used the brackets to delimit these phrases for clarity,
since I didn't think I could get away with quotes

I'm not so sure bitness, or the apologetic form "bitness", is any
clearer.

Some posters in (IIRC) the news.software.readers newsgroup are in the
habit of remarking on quotes as indicating that the writer doesn't mean
what he wrote, and I'm much inclined to take it the same way. As an
example, think of an ad saying

Guaranteed for "life".

YMMV