OT - Wi-Fi questions

J

jkneese

Need some help from a kind-hearted soul. I am about to enter an
assisted-living facility and was told they have Wi-Fi internet service. I
know absolutely nothing about Wi-Fi so have a few specific questions.

1. Can I assume a USB Wi-Fi adaptor is what I need to use my existing PC
(Win 7 Home Prem. 64-bit)?

2. How does one log on or otherwise connect to a Wi-Fi system?

3. Am I assigned a username/password and do I log on each session?

4. What about e-mail? Is that the same as (3. above) or a different
username/password?

Anything you can pass along will be greatly appreciated.

Jay Kneese
 
A

Andy Burns

jkneese said:
Need some help from a kind-hearted soul. I am about to enter an
assisted-living facility and was told they have Wi-Fi internet service.
I know absolutely nothing about Wi-Fi so have a few specific questions.

1. Can I assume a USB Wi-Fi adaptor is what I need to use my existing PC
(Win 7 Home Prem. 64-bit)?
Assuming this is a desktop, rather than a laptop yes, if it's a laptop I
assume you'd realise it's practically certain to have WiFi built in, if
it's new enough to run Win7.
2. How does one log on or otherwise connect to a Wi-Fi system?
Windows should "see" all available wiFi networks, and you click on the
relevant one to connect to it, the network ought to be secured and will
prompt for a security "key"
3. Am I assigned a username/password and do I log on each session?
There's just the key, it's not personal to you, but shared by all people
accessing the WiFi, Windows will store it for you, you won't be prompted
again.
4. What about e-mail? Is that the same as (3. above) or a different
username/password?
Once you're connected you can access web, email, skype or whatever just
like you do now, if your email is tied to your current provider and
you're closing that home ISP account to move into the sheltered
accomodation, you might need to set up a new email provider.
Anything you can pass along will be greatly appreciated.
If your machine is a desktop PC, you might want to fit the USB WiFi
dongle onto a USB extension lead, so it can be positioned to pick up a
better signal, rather than the dongle being down at low level hidden
behind the PC, also less likely to being snapped off!
 
J

J. P. Gilliver (John)

Andy said:
Assuming this is a desktop, rather than a laptop yes, if it's a laptop
I assume you'd realise it's practically certain to have WiFi built in,
if it's new enough to run Win7.


Windows should "see" all available wiFi networks, and you click on the
relevant one to connect to it, the network ought to be secured and will
prompt for a security "key"
Indeed: as "Alias" says, if it isn't secured (doesn't ask), it's a dodgy
network, or at least open to any dodgy character. If it does prompt for
a key (which you will have to be told by the facility's staff), you only
have to enter it once: your PC will remember each network's password.
This also applies if you take your PC to visit anyone else (your
children perhaps) who have wifi and are willing to give you the key -
your PC will remember the password for each network you connect to.
There's just the key, it's not personal to you, but shared by all
people accessing the WiFi, Windows will store it for you, you won't be
prompted again.
That's the usual situation, though I think usernames are not unheard of.
It's also possible to set up a wifi router so that it will only allow
devices on a list inside it to connect: if they do this, either you'll
need to give them the ID of your device (USB dongle or laptop itself),
or they'll need to do something (I've seen routers where you press a
button on the router and anything that tries to connect in the following
few minutes gets added to the list, which seemed a good compromise
between security and usability). However, most places that "provide
wifi" don't restrict in this way, it being too much bother - they just
use a "key" (something you have to type in, once) which they give you.
(In theory they should change it from time to time, though they
obviously have to tell all the users whenever they do.)
Once you're connected you can access web, email, skype or whatever just
like you do now, if your email is tied to your current provider and
you're closing that home ISP account to move into the sheltered
accomodation, you might need to set up a new email provider.
As Andy says, if your email is web-based, it'll work fine. If not, and
you want to keep your existing email account (and, probably, pay your
existing provider for it), which you might I suppose if you don't want
to change the email address you've been using for years (and tell all
your contacts), then:
Sending: either you'll need to configure your mail software to use the
SMTP server provided by the company providing the wifi service to the
facility, or you'll have to set up authenticated use of your original
provider's SMTP server. You may already have this set up; however, a lot
of providers allow unauthenticated use of their server provided users
are physically connected via a known account. If you're very unlucky,
your existing provider won't allow email sending _except_ via such a
connection; in that case you'd need to find another one (hopefully the
one provided by the facility's provider) that will, and will also allow
your emails to have a different "From" or "Reply-to" address.
Receiving: again, it depends whether your existing provider allows
collection of mail from their server (POP3 rather than SMTP this time)
with authentication.
If you _do_ want to keep your existing email as privided by your
existing supplier (again, this is irrelevant for a web-based system),
it'd be worth asking them if they do a simpler (and thus cheaper)
provision that does email only, since you won't be wanting broadband
from them.

Looking back at the original post, I see you're at an @yahoo.com
address: I think that's one of those that will work regardless anyway,
certainly if you do all your email via a web browser. (If you don't -
and I see you are using Windows Live Mail, though obviously I don't know
if you use that for email as well as for posting - then it might be
worth asking anyone you know inside the facility who uses yahoo, what if
anything _they_ had to do.)
If your machine is a desktop PC, you might want to fit the USB WiFi
dongle onto a USB extension lead, so it can be positioned to pick up a
better signal, rather than the dongle being down at low level hidden
behind the PC, also less likely to being snapped off!
Good advice! In the UK, poundshops (shops where everything is a pound,
or 99p) often sell USB hubs (and sometimes other USB toys) with a short
(say 6") USB extension lead: it's probably cheaper to buy that (whether
you use the hub or not) than to buy the lead alone anywhere else. (I
don't know where you are, but I imagine the equivalent of poundshops are
everywhere.)

As Andy said, if it's a laptop, certainly one that came with 7 (or
Vista, or even many from the XP era), it'll probably have wifi built in.
Usually turned on by default anyway, but just in case it's turned off,
you'll obviously need to turn it on: sometimes a physical switch (often
at the front, sometimes a little underneath so you don't catch it by
mistake), sometimes just the function key plus one of the F keys (F9 on
this netbook). Look at the function keys for a suitable symbol -
sometimes waves radiating out from a point, sometimes a drawing of an
old-fashioned aerial. There's probably a light, as well, that comes on
when it's active - maybe next to the caps/shift/scroll lock lights,
maybe not, depending on the designer of the case.

If it is a laptop/netbook and you have a suitable friendly
neighbour/son/daughter/whatever who has wifi, take it round to their
place, and you can try all this out. You'll need them to tell you their
key of course. If no-one suitable is available, and assuming you live in
an ordinary street rather than an isolated home, you should still at
least be able to "see" several wifi networks, though you won't get any
further than attempting to connect and being asked for the key. (Unless
you have a neighbour who has set his/her network up as unsecured - it
isn't unknown! There may also be some which are part of wider "networks"
of a different kind - in the UK, BTOpenZone is one - where the
individual nodes _are_ unsecured, but if you try to connect to any
website through them, you see instead their payment page. They usually
block - by port number I think, we don't need to go into that here -
mail transfer, too, i. e. _only_ provide web access to everything. The
nodes in this case can be either things like petrol station signs, or
private individuals who allow their own system to be used by anyone who
has joined the system, in return for themselves being able to do so when
away from home.)
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G.5AL-IS-P--Ch++(p)Ar@T0H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

.... his charming, bumbling best, a serial monogamist terrified of commitment,
who comes across as a sort of Bertie Wooster but with a measurable IQ. - Barry
Norman on Hugh Grant's persona in certain films, Radio Times 3-9 July 2010
 
L

LouB

jkneese said:
Need some help from a kind-hearted soul. I am about to enter an
assisted-living facility and was told they have Wi-Fi internet service.
I know absolutely nothing about Wi-Fi so have a few specific questions.

1. Can I assume a USB Wi-Fi adaptor is what I need to use my existing PC
(Win 7 Home Prem. 64-bit)?

2. How does one log on or otherwise connect to a Wi-Fi system?

3. Am I assigned a username/password and do I log on each session?

4. What about e-mail? Is that the same as (3. above) or a different
username/password?

Anything you can pass along will be greatly appreciated.

Jay Kneese
With a little (maybe a lot) of luck there should be someone there that
knows the system so I would ask.

Lou
 
D

DanS

Need some help from a kind-hearted soul. I am about to
enter an assisted-living facility and was told they have
Wi-Fi internet service. I know absolutely nothing about
Wi-Fi so have a few specific questions.

1. Can I assume a USB Wi-Fi adaptor is what I need to use
my existing PC (Win 7 Home Prem. 64-bit)?

2. How does one log on or otherwise connect to a Wi-Fi
system?

3. Am I assigned a username/password and do I log on each
session?

4. What about e-mail? Is that the same as (3. above) or a
different username/password?
That all depends on your e-mail. If you currently use an e-
mail client, like your headers indicate you use MS Live Mail,
to connect to your current ISP's e-mail server, you may need
to change that...like if it's @verizon.net because you
currently have DSL.

I see your e-mail listed however is yahoo.com, so *that* will
not change. You can access that mail from any internet
connected PC in the world that has a browser.
 
D

DanS

In message


Indeed: as "Alias" says, if it isn't secured (doesn't ask),
it's a dodgy network, or at least open to any dodgy
character. If it does prompt for a key (which you will have
to be told by the facility's staff), you only have to enter
it once: your PC will remember each network's password.
This also applies if you take your PC to visit anyone else
(your children perhaps) who have wifi and are willing to
give you the key - your PC will remember the password for
each network you connect to.
I'd also suggest to *typically* turn of file and printer
sharing, if those aren't required.
 
K

Ken Blake

Assuming this is a desktop, rather than a laptop yes,

No, not really. That's one choice, but it's not the only one--not what
he *needs*. He could also buy and install a wi-fi card in the
computer.
 
S

SC Tom

jkneese said:
Need some help from a kind-hearted soul. I am about to enter an assisted-living facility and was told they have Wi-Fi
internet service. I know absolutely nothing about Wi-Fi so have a few specific questions.

1. Can I assume a USB Wi-Fi adaptor is what I need to use my existing PC (Win 7 Home Prem. 64-bit)?

2. How does one log on or otherwise connect to a Wi-Fi system?

3. Am I assigned a username/password and do I log on each session?

4. What about e-mail? Is that the same as (3. above) or a different username/password?

Anything you can pass along will be greatly appreciated.

Jay Kneese
Along with Andy's excellent answers, I would advise talking to the IT person or rep at the facility. They probably have
either someone on site, or they'll give you documentation on how to set it up and a number to call if you run into a
problem.

Enjoy your stay! My SO's aunt lives in one in Connecticut and wishes she had moved into it earlier. I have not heard one
single complaint from her, and she's still very sharp mentally, so it's not like she doesn't know what's going on around
her. She just loves the people and the "Chablis with Sunday dinner." :)
 
C

Char Jackson

That's the usual situation, though I think usernames are not unheard of.
It's also possible to set up a wifi router so that it will only allow
devices on a list inside it to connect: if they do this, either you'll
need to give them the ID of your device (USB dongle or laptop itself),
or they'll need to do something (I've seen routers where you press a
button on the router and anything that tries to connect in the following
few minutes gets added to the list, which seemed a good compromise
between security and usability). However, most places that "provide
wifi" don't restrict in this way, it being too much bother - they just
use a "key" (something you have to type in, once) which they give you.
(In theory they should change it from time to time, though they
obviously have to tell all the users whenever they do.)
I've done some contract work in these kinds of facilities and mostly
I've found things to be the way you described, but in a few cases they
had a RADIUS server running so that each resident had a unique key
rather than everyone using a shared key.
 
J

J. P. Gilliver (John)

Ken Blake said:
No, not really. That's one choice, but it's not the only one--not what
he *needs*. He could also buy and install a wi-fi card in the
computer.
A wifi card will take up a slot (probably not a problem), will probably
cost more (it shouldn't, as there's less on it! But supply and demand
....), and will have an aerial that's less optimisable (for the basic
aerial - though it's likely to be more sensitive, and also connected to
a socket you can in theory add other aerials to).

A USB dongle will use up a USB port (some machines are a bit short of
these, though not recent ones), will probably cost less, and will have a
deafer aerial (though if used with an extension lead can probably be
better positioned).

If it _is_ a laptop, you may also be able to find a card that goes into
whatever sort of expansion slot it has (PCMCIA on older ones, I forget
what it's called for newer), but again it's likely to cost more than a
USB one, so I wouldn't bother unless you're very short of USB slots.
(And of course if it's a laptop it's highly unlikely not to have wifi
built in anyway, so you don't need anything.)
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G.5AL-IS-P--Ch++(p)Ar@T0H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

.... his charming, bumbling best, a serial monogamist terrified of commitment,
who comes across as a sort of Bertie Wooster but with a measurable IQ. - Barry
Norman on Hugh Grant's persona in certain films, Radio Times 3-9 July 2010
 
K

Ken Blake

A wifi card will take up a slot (probably not a problem), will probably
cost more (it shouldn't, as there's less on it! But supply and demand
...), and will have an aerial that's less optimisable (for the basic
aerial - though it's likely to be more sensitive, and also connected to
a socket you can in theory add other aerials to).

A USB dongle will use up a USB port (some machines are a bit short of
these, though not recent ones), will probably cost less, and will have a
deafer aerial (though if used with an extension lead can probably be
better positioned).

I wasn't arguing for one choice or the other. I was simply pointing
out that were two choices. Andy Burns said that the USB device is what
he "needs," and that's not correct.
 
S

soup

Andy Burns wrote

It's also possible to set up a wifi router so that it will only allow
devices on a list inside it to connect: if they do this, either you'll
need to give them the ID of your device (USB dongle or laptop itself),
Usually called MAC filtering it is fairly trivial to find your machines
MAC (using a command[CMD]box and it is generally listed as the physical
addres) and give it to the facilities IT bod. However MAC filtering is
quite hard to administer and is fairly trivial to "break" ( one of my
lecturers used to "war drive" as a hobby and he said MAC filtering was
next to useless). This rather assumes a fulltime(ish) IT bod, which any
assisted living facility is unlikely to have . ICBW but asking someone
who is already using it is the way to go.

Connecting to a Wi-Fi signal is simplisity itself just folloew/input
the requested information when asked for .

Email will be OK (as others have mentioned) if it is webmail (Hotmail,
GMail, Yahoo etc). E-mail addresses from your old ISP will probably be
lost (Virginmedia et al allow web access to your e-mail but you will
(probably) need to pay them to keep that account open).
 
C

Char Jackson

I wasn't arguing for one choice or the other. I was simply pointing
out that were two choices. Andy Burns said that the USB device is what
he "needs," and that's not correct.
There are some fringe cases where either of those solutions falls
short, but I agree that you guys pretty much have it covered for the
OP. Sometimes I find that I need more flexibility in where the radio
receiver is placed, so I use a wireless router, flashed with dd-wrt
and configured as a client bridge. That allows me to place it wherever
there's an Ethernet connection and allows multiple PC's to share the
Wi-Fi access. I buy Linksys WRT54GL's 10 at a time for this purpose.
 
J

J. P. Gilliver (John)

Andy Burns wrote

It's also possible to set up a wifi router so that it will only allow
devices on a list inside it to connect: if they do this, either you'll
need to give them the ID of your device (USB dongle or laptop itself),
Usually called MAC filtering it is fairly trivial to find your machines
MAC (using a command[CMD]box and it is generally listed as the physical
addres) and give it to the facilities IT bod. However MAC filtering is
Yes; for most wifi devices I've come across (both USB and actual
computers with it built in), it's on a sticker on the device itself, or
occasionally stuck to the instruction booklet.
quite hard to administer and is fairly trivial to "break" ( one of my
Well, not hard to administer if the facility has a router of the type I
described earlier, which has a button on it, which when pressed allows
anything to connect and be added in the few minutes after the button
press. However, I don't know how common or otherwise such routers are:
the one I saw was provided by Orange (an internet service provider, and
much else, in UK), and was their default home device, called a something
box. (It also had a socket you could plug an ordinary telephone into, to
use internet telephony - like Skype.)
lecturers used to "war drive" as a hobby and he said MAC filtering was
next to useless). This rather assumes a fulltime(ish) IT bod, which
any assisted living facility is unlikely to have . ICBW but asking
someone who is already using it is the way to go.
Certainly seconded. And I've never encountered anywhere actually using
MAC filtering, other than this Orange box which I think had that mode
selected by default. (You say next to useless: surely it requires the
ability to fake a MAC address, which is probably not entirely trivial,
nonne?)

(There's also the inverse: allow all MACs _except_ a blacklist. Again,
I've never heard of anywhere using it, but could be useful where you've
got a persistent nuisance/offender!)
Connecting to a Wi-Fi signal is simplisity itself just folloew/input
the requested information when asked for .
Yup.

Email will be OK (as others have mentioned) if it is webmail (Hotmail,
GMail, Yahoo etc). E-mail addresses from your old ISP will probably be
lost (Virginmedia et al allow web access to your e-mail but you will
(probably) need to pay them to keep that account open).
Though it should be a lot less than what they charge you to provide full
ISP service - if it isn't, bite the bullet and move, despite the
inconvenience of having to tell all your contacts. Probably not
jkneese's problem anyway, as s/he seems to be on yahoo.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G.5AL-IS-P--Ch++(p)Ar@T0H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

.... his charming, bumbling best, a serial monogamist terrified of commitment,
who comes across as a sort of Bertie Wooster but with a measurable IQ. - Barry
Norman on Hugh Grant's persona in certain films, Radio Times 3-9 July 2010
 
J

J. P. Gilliver (John)

Ken Blake said:
I wasn't arguing for one choice or the other. I was simply pointing
out that were two choices. Andy Burns said that the USB device is what
he "needs," and that's not correct.
You _can_ be _too_ pedantic (-:! The OP used the word "need", too. I
suppose a good answer would be "you need _something_ that provides wifi
facility to your computer: if a recent netbook/laptop it's almost
certainly got it already, otherwise yes, a USB dongle is probably the
easiest and cheapest, though an internal card (PCI if it's a desktop,
PCMCIA or the modern equivalent if it's a laptop with a slot) will do as
well."
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G.5AL-IS-P--Ch++(p)Ar@T0H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

.... his charming, bumbling best, a serial monogamist terrified of commitment,
who comes across as a sort of Bertie Wooster but with a measurable IQ. - Barry
Norman on Hugh Grant's persona in certain films, Radio Times 3-9 July 2010
 
C

Char Jackson

Andy Burns wrote
It's also possible to set up a wifi router so that it will only allow
devices on a list inside it to connect: if they do this, either you'll
need to give them the ID of your device (USB dongle or laptop itself),
Usually called MAC filtering it is fairly trivial to find your machines
MAC (using a command[CMD]box and it is generally listed as the physical
addres) and give it to the facilities IT bod. However MAC filtering is
Yes; for most wifi devices I've come across (both USB and actual
computers with it built in), it's on a sticker on the device itself, or
occasionally stuck to the instruction booklet.
quite hard to administer and is fairly trivial to "break" ( one of my
[]
Certainly seconded. And I've never encountered anywhere actually using
MAC filtering, other than this Orange box which I think had that mode
selected by default. (You say next to useless: surely it requires the
ability to fake a MAC address, which is probably not entirely trivial,
nonne?)
For someone who is bent on circumventing MAC filtering, it takes only
a few seconds.
(There's also the inverse: allow all MACs _except_ a blacklist. Again,
I've never heard of anywhere using it, but could be useful where you've
got a persistent nuisance/offender!)
Given how easy it is to change a MAC address, I don't think
blacklisting would be much of a deterrent at all. OTOH, whitelisting
isn't much better, which is why MAC filtering is not a very useful
tool in the security toolbox.
 
K

Ken Blake

You _can_ be _too_ pedantic (-:! The OP used the word "need", too.

Yes, I know the OP did. But I don't think I was being pedantic at all.
The OP asked "Can I assume a USB Wi-Fi adaptor is what I need to use
my existing PC (Win 7 Home Prem. 64-bit)?" and Andy Burns's reply, if
left uncorrected, would make the OP think his assumption was correct
and he had no other choices.

The OP's question was whether he had other choices, and letting him
know that he did was meant to do a service to him and not to correct
Andy Burns (who probably knew there were two choices, and just worded
his answer poorly).
 
S

soup

You say next to useless: surely it requires the
ability to fake a MAC address, which is probably not entirely trivial,
nonne?)
For those with even a little knowledge and the ability to Google
(verbing a noun tsk), spoofing a Mac address is (relatively)easy.
There is a 'next to' in there as a CYA

These instructions found within two minutes.
http://www.mydigitallife.info/how-t...ista-server-20032008-mac-os-x-unix-and-linux/

At college the network would only allow machines with known MACs to
connect (this took two days notice to the ITbods up in the CSU) so when
we installed or played with the system as part of the course (HND
Computer Networking)we would spoof the MACs to one that was allowed on
the college network, we became quite adept at this spoofing.
 
M

Muad'Dib

Need some help from a kind-hearted soul. I am about to enter an
assisted-living facility and was told they have Wi-Fi internet service.
I know absolutely nothing about Wi-Fi so have a few specific questions.

1. Can I assume a USB Wi-Fi adaptor is what I need to use my existing PC
(Win 7 Home Prem. 64-bit)?

2. How does one log on or otherwise connect to a Wi-Fi system?

3. Am I assigned a username/password and do I log on each session?

4. What about e-mail? Is that the same as (3. above) or a different
username/password?

Anything you can pass along will be greatly appreciated.

Jay Kneese
Wow, good grief people, this isn't rocket sci-entry. Most all of it
depends on the the Assisted Living policies and procedures. Why are we
making this seem harder than it is? Established is that they have
wireless, Ok no big deal. Buy a USB adapter, install the software if
needed for your operating system, find out if they require a wireless
password, which they should. If they broadcast the name of the wireless
system where you can choose it, just click on it in the wireless
manager, it will then ask for the password, enter it and you are
connected. You then can access your email, the web etc. Once you have
obtained the Internet connection you should be able to do whatever you
need. I can hardly believe the assisted living center couldn't exactly
guide you through what is needed to connect to their system. Just ask
them! We here can guess all day long, but we have NO idea how THEY have
set up THEIR system. Ask them! To the rest of you, Good God, talk about
over thinking things!

G'day
 
M

Muad'Dib

Wow, good grief people, this isn't rocket sci-entry. Most all of it
depends on the the Assisted Living policies and procedures. Why are we
making this seem harder than it is? Established is that they have
wireless, Ok no big deal. Buy a USB adapter, install the software if
needed for your operating system, find out if they require a wireless
password, which they should. If they broadcast the name of the wireless
system where you can choose it, just click on it in the wireless
manager, it will then ask for the password, enter it and you are
connected. You then can access your email, the web etc. Once you have
obtained the Internet connection you should be able to do whatever you
need. I can hardly believe the assisted living center couldn't exactly
guide you through what is needed to connect to their system. Just ask
them! We here can guess all day long, but we have NO idea how THEY have
set up THEIR system. Ask them! To the rest of you, Good God, talk about
over thinking things!

G'day
...Oh yeah, anything I purposely typed in all caps to STRONGLY emphasize
something, was totally directed to the CAPS GOD NAZI known as Ken Blake.

G'day
 

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