SOLVED Need help with installing 2nd drive

catilley1092

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The drive enclosure that Nibiru finally arrived today, and in all of 10 minutes, it was put together, plugged in to test it, it shows fine. I want to be able to boot into this drive, and install other OS's. I need to know how to set this up. But I do have one problem that needs to be resolved beforehand. I installed my recovery partition on here, and loaded the original system. Then I tried to "shrink" it, to allow me plenty of space. But out of this large drive, even after defragmenting, it would only allow me to shrink by 200,000 something MB. But this is my problem, and why I even brought this up. I have 7 Ultimate (for the BitLocker deal). After setting up a dual boot (Pro & Ultimate), clean install, it looks and runs better than with the OEM install. It's no longer on here, except the recovery partition itself. I setup BitLocker, and tested it on a USB flash drive. It wouldn't work, something about a TPM module. Well, when I installed my 2nd drive on here, when I clicked Computer (to the right of the Start Menu), BitLocker appeared at the bottom of the screen. Then, when I removed the drive, it disappeared. Is my being able to use BitLocker tied to my OEM install? Should I attempt to "shrink" the OEM install on my second drive, and leave it there? The only thing that I do know, the program that makes it run must be in my OEM install, otherwise, why did it show up? This is overshadowing my other concern, how to boot into the drive. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
 

catilley1092

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OK, I'm doing one thing here, if it will help. On my new drive, I have Pro installed on a 100GB partition (the first one). I'm currently backing up the original install from the 2nd hard drive (the system and HP partition). Being that I'm primarily using Ultimate, can I do whatever it takes to move this backup to my new drive (on the first partition), so that I'll have all of my needed drivers to install and use BitLocker? Then, get the drive going, so that I can add my other OS's. I'm willing to do whatever it takes to get this to work. If I have to "shrink" the original drive, I'll do that. But I'm trying to prepare for whatever may needs to be done.
 

yodap

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What is the enclosure? e-sata, usb or both? Firewire? AC powered adapter?

Can you describe exactly how your partitions are laid out. Drive sizes, partition sizes and corrisponding OS's for each? Boot order and also what you want the end result to be?
 

catilley1092

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The enclosure is a USB one. There are no other options. It is AC powered, cuts off with a switch. The drive in it contains my original install, as Clifford advised me not to do anything with it until everything is right. It also contains my recovery partition, which I want to leave there, in case I want to sell the computer. The HP image on it is about 30GB total, counting the 100MB system partition, the partition is 286GB total. The recovery partition has been copied to this new drive, using Macrium. On the new drive, there is a 100GB partition containing 7 Pro, a 200GB partition containing 7 Ultimate, approximate half of my new drive is empty (by design), as I want to install the beta of the next Windows on it. The boot order is Ultimate first, Pro second. I've tried to install BitLocker, but couldn't, because something from the original drive is not here. But when the new drive is plugged in, the option is there for it. I want this second drive to be used for Linux. Is there anyway that I can take the backup that I just created with Macrium (the 100MB system image and the HP install), and somehow place it on the partition where Pro is now? I tried doing this the easy way, using the recovery and it worked. But I couldn't shrink the partition anymore than 200,000MB, even after defrag. I hope this is enough to help information to get started with. PS: The Pro partition is "D" drive, Ultimate is "C" drive. I'm currently backing up "C" drive (Ultimate) with Macrium (disc image).
 
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yodap

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Do the pro and ultimate each have the 100MB partitions? Do you know about the 4 primary partition limit?
 
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catilley1092

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No, I'm looking where you can do partitioning, the only 100MB is on Pro (D), the first partition. I'm almost through doing a disc image of the Ultimate (C) partition, in case it's needed.
 

yodap

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Where are keeping all these Macrium images?

It's 1:00 am! I must get some sleep now.
 
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Do the pro and ultimate each have the 100MB partitions?
This is my understanding of the 100MB partition.

The 100MB partition contains the boot files and Vista Boot Loader. Professional and Ultimate would share this 100MB partition. The purpose behind this 100MB partition is to allow the computer to boot to a small partition that is not encrypted while allowing the main partition to be encrypted. Hence the program Bitlocker. Once you select which partition to boot to from there, Bitlocker will decrypt and continue to boot.

If you have no intention in using bitlocker this 100MB partition is not needed. I for one don't have it. I find it needlessly taking one of my primary partitions. We are only alloted 4 primary partitions per hard disk.
 

catilley1092

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I do intend to use BitLocker, this is what I'm trying to achieve, I've set it up, the key is in my backup drive. But when I tested it a couple of days ago on a flash drive, it wouldn't work. Then, after I got this second (my original drive) going, the BitLocker options are there. There must be something in the original drive that contains the needed files for this to work. I know it said something about a TPM was corrupt or missing. It's on my original install.
 

Nibiru2012

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BitLocker makes use of a hardware chip called a Trusted Platform Module or TPM. When you turn on the computer, BitLocker communicates with the TPM to make sure the Operating System hasn’t been tampered with. If everything is ok, BitLocker then sends a key to the software on your hard drive, allowing it to boot.

From Wikipedia:
Operation
Contrary to the official name, BitLocker Drive Encryption is a logical volume encryption system. A volume may or may not be an entire drive, and can span one or more physical drives. Also, when enabled TPM/Bitlocker can ensure the integrity of the trusted boot path (e.g. BIOS, boot sector, etc.), in order to prevent most offline physical attacks, boot sector malware, etc.

In order for BitLocker to operate, the hard disk requires at least two NTFS-formatted volumes: one for the operating system (usually C:) and another with a minimum size of 100MB from which the operating system boots. BitLocker requires the boot volume to remain unencrypted—on Windows Vista this volume must be assigned a drive letter, while on Windows 7 it does not. Unlike previous versions of Windows, Vista's "diskpart" command-line tool includes the ability to shrink the size of an NTFS volume so that the system volume for BitLocker can be created from already-allocated space. A tool called the "Bitlocker Drive Preparation Tool" is also available from Microsoft that allows an existing volume on Windows Vista to be shrunk to make room for a new boot volume, and for the necessary bootstrapping files to be transferred to it;[12] Windows 7 creates the secondary boot volume by default, even if Bitlocker is not used initially.

Once an alternate boot partition has been created, the TPM module needs to be initialized (assuming that this feature is being used), after which the required disk encryption key protection mechanisms such as TPM, PIN or USB key are configured. The volume is then encrypted as a background task, something that can take a considerable amount of time with a large disk as every logical sector is read, encrypted and rewritten back to disk. Only once the whole volume has been encrypted are the keys protected, and the volume considered secure. BitLocker uses a low-level device driver to encrypt and decrypt all file operations, making interaction with the encrypted volume transparent to applications running on the platform.

Encrypting File System may be used in conjunction with BitLocker to provide protection once the operating system kernel is running. Protection of the files from processes/users within the operating system can only be performed using encryption software that operates within Windows, such as Encrypting File System. BitLocker and Encrypting File System therefore offer protection against different classes of attacks.[13]

In Active Directory environments, BitLocker supports optional key escrow to Active Directory, although a schema update may be required for this to work (i.e. if the Active Directory Directory Services are hosted on a Windows version previous to Windows Server 2008).

Other systems like BitLocker can have their recovery key/password entry process spoofed by another bootmanager or OS install. Once the spoofed software captured the secret, it could be used to decrypt the VMK, which would then allow access to decrypt or modify any information on the user's BitLocker-encrypted hard disk. By configuring a TPM to protect the trusted boot pathway, including the BIOS and boot sector, this threat can be removed.
 

catilley1092

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I think I've found the way to restore the original partition, it will involve overwriting part of the one Ultimate is on, then restore Ultimate. PS: It can't be done this way, the files are smaller, but the partition is larger.
 
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catilley1092

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I may or may not be onto something here. I've tried to "shrink" the original partition on the 2nd drive to make it match the size (or smaller) than what I have. I have made it a little smaller, but some files are scattered too far. Some way or the other, I'll pull this off.
 

yodap

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This is my understanding of the 100MB partition.

The 100MB partition contains the boot files and Vista Boot Loader. Professional and Ultimate would share this 100MB partition. The purpose behind this 100MB partition is to allow the computer to boot to a small partition that is not encrypted while allowing the main partition to be encrypted. Hence the program Bitlocker. Once you select which partition to boot to from there, Bitlocker will decrypt and continue to boot.

If you have no intention in using bitlocker this 100MB partition is not needed. I for one don't have it. I find it needlessly taking one of my primary partitions. We are only alloted 4 primary partitions per hard disk.
Interesting. Why then is it created automatically on the versions that do not come with Bitlocker? I would love to recoup that primary partition on my disk. Can it be done after the fact on Home Premium?
 
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The partition (25GB and greater) must be preformated when installing windows 7. If not Windows 7 will create the 100MB partition.

My only guess as to why the 100MB partition is created on a version that does not support Bitlocker. Is that the 100MB partition already exist when customers purchase the Anytime Upgrade to a version that does support Bitlocker.
 

yodap

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I've been searching this all morning and the partition also contains the WinRE files for start-up and repair as well as the boot files. It is a convenience for the potential Bitlocker files. My only gripe is that it takes a potential important primary partition away from you.

In Charles' case, he may not be able to install a future windows beta OS on that drive. As I see it now he already has 3 primary's. If he wants to utilize any of the remaining space on that new drive he will have to plan ahead by researching the possibilities and restrictions. Just thinking out loud here.
 

Nibiru2012

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I found this at a site called: Brett's Tech Blog

(In addition to the BitLocker feature the following helps explain the partition.)

Windows 7 100MB Partition Mystery Solved

One of the things that I didn’t like when I installed Windows 7, it automatically made a 100MB partition. In previous versions of Windows, I had the option of using the entire disk when installing the OS.

When trying to do the same thing in Windows 7, I still ended up with Windows forcing me of using 100MB of my hard drive space for whatever Windows 7 wanted it for. Now I know 100MB isn’t a whole lot, but every space counts for me.

Today I found out what that 100MB partition is for. In Windows XP, if your system decided to go crazy, you had several options, like using Last Known Good Configuration, and if that didn’t work, you could attempt to use the Recovery Console, which was confusing at most. So the next best option was to either reimage or reload the operating system.

In Windows Vista and Windows Server 2008, Microsoft came out with a new tool to do a recovery of your OS in case of emergencies. Calling it Windows Recovery Environment, or WinRE for short, and put it on the Windows Vista and Windows Server 2008 DVD’s.

But with Windows 7 and Windows Server 2008 R2, this feature is built in the OS, hence this is where the 100MB partition comes in.

The entire Windows Recovery Environment is installed on that 100MB partition, and is hidden by default, to prevent viruses or other malicious stuff to make any changes to WinRE.

You can read more and find out how to use the new Windows Recovery Environment via the link below:
Rescue Windows 7 in Five Minutes or Less –IT Expert Voice
 
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catilley1092

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OK, job #1 is complete! I've restored the original install on here on the small partition that I created for Pro when I clean installed it. How, and it didn't take my whole disc over, as usual with system recovery? By installing Linux Mint on the partition from Ultimate forward to the recovery partition. Then, after rebooting Mint, it gives you every partition that you have to boot. The recovery partition is listed as Vista, for some reason, I selected that, the recovery began. But when recovering with Linux installed, it doesn't overwrite the Linux files, only the Windows partition. So, the original install is now on a 100GB partition by itself. Then, I went into partitioning and cleared the Linux files. After fully updating, and installing my Pro Anytime Upgrade key (all went well), I installed Macrium. Then I went to the image file that I created for Ultimate last night, recovered it to my computer, and after all was done, rebooted. There was one last thing, I had to insert my Ultimate disc and do a repair to put my drive letters & paths in the right places. So now my computer is right. It shows Windows 7, and Windows 7 Ultimate (recovered) at boot up. Now, I must delete the original install from the old drive (leaving the recovery partition), and figure out how to install my other OS's on it.
 

catilley1092

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There is one thing about the reinstall, it may or may not be a problem. It's no problem booting into either partition and using them. But on the partition that contains the original install, you click the Start menu, then Computer, no drive shows up for Ultimate. You go to partitioning, it shows it as a healthy partition, but no drive letter. But when you boot into Ultimate, the proper drives & letters are showing. The computer is working fine. Will this create a problem for me at some point, or does it not show this because Ultimate was repaired? PS: BitLocker is working, I tried it out on a flash drive.
 
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yodap

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You should be able to simply assign a drive letter, for instance "Z" or any available to that partition, from within the original install.

Nice job!
 

catilley1092

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I tried everything that I could think of before doing this. Had the original install "shrank" some more, I could have installed it with little or no problem. But there were unmovable files that were far away from the others. I mean, it was only 35GB or less of data involved, the partition was the trouble. And I didn't want the same thing to happen again, so that's why I installed Linux Mint, leaving only 100GB for the original install. BitLocker works fine, I tried it out on a flash drive (4GB), it took forever to encrypt it. Does this happen every time, or only the first time? So, now what I'm left with is this: Making that second hard drive to where I can install Linux on it. I tried booting it, but the only thing that happened was the recovery partition tried to boot, then some code appeared, it was fast, then it did a regular boot. So I must be doing something wrong here. Hopefully, with some help, I can figure this one out. If necessary, I can delete the recovery partition from it, I have it backed up, in case I need to reinstall it again.
 

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