100MB partition (Win7 HP 64-bit)

[SC Tom]

I recently bought a new Acer Aspire V3 laptop that came with the Win7 64-bit
setup partition. I ran it, installed Win7, cleaned all the crap off I didn't
want/need, and installed some of the programs I wanted on it (still more to
go- that's an ongoing thing, IYKWIM). After I got things the way I wanted, I
booted from my ATI CD to create an image of the whole drive, including the
hidden "PQService" recovery partition, the 100MB "System Reserved" one, and
of course, my C: partition.

The question I have is, if I just created an image of the C: partition
without the other two partitions, and restored the C: to a new drive, is
that new drive going to boot on its own, or do you think I'll have to run
Startup Repair to do it? In Disk Management, the System Reserved partition
just says "Healthy (System, Active, Primary Partition)", whereas my C: says
"Healthy (Boot, Page File, Crash Dump, Primary Partition)". That leads me to
believe that C: will boot on its own, but just thought I'd ask the opinion
of others here.

I haven't tried deleting the 100MB partition as per the instructions here:

http://www.terabyteunlimited.com/kb/article.php?id=409

since 100MB one way or the other is not really taking a bite out of my 500GB
drive. If I get to the point where I need that 100MB, I think it'll be time
for a new, larger drive

TIA!

 

[Char Jackson]

I recently bought a new Acer Aspire V3 laptop that came with the Win7 64-bit
setup partition. I ran it, installed Win7, cleaned all the crap off I didn't
want/need, and installed some of the programs I wanted on it (still more to
go- that's an ongoing thing, IYKWIM). After I got things the way I wanted, I
booted from my ATI CD to create an image of the whole drive, including the
hidden "PQService" recovery partition, the 100MB "System Reserved" one, and
of course, my C: partition.

The question I have is, if I just created an image of the C: partition
without the other two partitions, and restored the C: to a new drive, is
that new drive going to boot on its own, or do you think I'll have to run
Startup Repair to do it? In Disk Management, the System Reserved partition
just says "Healthy (System, Active, Primary Partition)", whereas my C: says
"Healthy (Boot, Page File, Crash Dump, Primary Partition)". That leads me to
believe that C: will boot on its own, but just thought I'd ask the opinion
of others here.

Keep in mind that Windows boots from the System partition and stores
its system files on the Boot partition. With that in mind, I believe
the answer is no, the PC will not boot if you restore _only_ the C:
partition to a new drive.

I would make an image of the entire drive. In that case, you could
restore it to another drive and it will be bootable.

 

[Ed Cryer]

I recently bought a new Acer Aspire V3 laptop that came with the Win7
64-bit setup partition. I ran it, installed Win7, cleaned all the crap
off I didn't want/need, and installed some of the programs I wanted on
it (still more to go- that's an ongoing thing, IYKWIM). After I got
things the way I wanted, I booted from my ATI CD to create an image of
the whole drive, including the hidden "PQService" recovery partition,
the 100MB "System Reserved" one, and of course, my C: partition.

The question I have is, if I just created an image of the C: partition
without the other two partitions, and restored the C: to a new drive, is
that new drive going to boot on its own, or do you think I'll have to
run Startup Repair to do it? In Disk Management, the System Reserved
partition just says "Healthy (System, Active, Primary Partition)",
whereas my C: says "Healthy (Boot, Page File, Crash Dump, Primary
Partition)". That leads me to believe that C: will boot on its own, but
just thought I'd ask the opinion of others here.

I haven't tried deleting the 100MB partition as per the instructions here:

http://www.terabyteunlimited.com/kb/article.php?id=409

since 100MB one way or the other is not really taking a bite out of my
500GB drive. If I get to the point where I need that 100MB, I think
it'll be time for a new, larger drive

TIA!

That's exactly the situation with my last two Acer desktops.

My recovery partition is 100% free; the system reserved 70% free. That
means that it takes the blink of an eye to back them both up. So what I
do each month or so is take a system image of the whole drive. I have
1TB C, 1TB D (which I hardly ever use, preferring to keep all my music
and such on an external disk. The image contains all four partitions.

I do this for the possibility of total disk replacement. In that case
the procedure would be;
1. Replace HD.
2. Restore from last image.

You could, of course, use your plan B; backup just C. And then in the
case of total disk replacement you'd just have to add Start-up Repair as
item 3. But that might not create the Acer-style system reserved;
probably won't. And that makes me wary because maybe some Acer utilities
need that.
Hence my tactic of putting it on the backup.

Ed

 

[...winston]

"SC Tom" wrote in message I recently bought a new Acer Aspire V3 laptop that came with the Win7 64-bit
setup partition. I ran it, installed Win7, cleaned all the crap off I didn't
want/need, and installed some of the programs I wanted on it (still more to
go- that's an ongoing thing, IYKWIM). After I got things the way I wanted, I
booted from my ATI CD to create an image of the whole drive, including the
hidden "PQService" recovery partition, the 100MB "System Reserved" one, and
of course, my C: partition.

The question I have is, if I just created an image of the C: partition
without the other two partitions, and restored the C: to a new drive, is
that new drive going to boot on its own, or do you think I'll have to run
Startup Repair to do it? In Disk Management, the System Reserved partition
just says "Healthy (System, Active, Primary Partition)", whereas my C: says
"Healthy (Boot, Page File, Crash Dump, Primary Partition)". That leads me to
believe that C: will boot on its own, but just thought I'd ask the opinion
of others here.

I haven't tried deleting the 100MB partition as per the instructions here:

http://www.terabyteunlimited.com/kb/article.php?id=409

since 100MB one way or the other is not really taking a bite out of my 500GB
drive. If I get to the point where I need that 100MB, I think it'll be time
for a new, larger drive
A. If you restore only the C:\ to a new drive the system won't boot since it
does not contain the bootloader files (see explanation below)

Windows 7, by design during an installation creates the 100MB System
Reserved partition (no drive letter - System Volume) and the Windows
operating system partition (Boot Volume). Both are created on the same disk
(hard drive).
1. When the pc is turned on the BIOS uses its configuration (on an Acer
usually called 'Boot Priority Order') to start the boot process. Normal
those options would be in order of DVD or CD, Hard Disk, USB Fixed Disk
Drive, Network, USB Hard Disk. (DVD being first so one can as you've done
boot from your ATI CD...if DVD/CD is not present/inserted in the DVD/CD drie
slot it moves on to the second prioritized item - Hard Disk)
2. The BIOS passes control to the hard disk containing the System Volume
(System Reserved partition which contains the Windows boot loader files and
the MBR) to start the boot process and determine where the installed Windows
o/s is located. If single boot, only one exists, if dual booting more than
one may exist.
3. The System Volume (System Reserved partition) then passes control to the
Boot Volume (the partition containing the operating system) to load Windows
and finally end up at the Windows logon screen or desktop.

Note:
- The System Volume (System Reserved) not only contains the bootloader files
it also includes the Windows repair utilities..thus if you restore only the
C:\ partition to a new drive, you'll need a Windows DVD (usually retail) to
run the repair option to rebuild the MBR and bootloader files.
- Repairing a drive lacking a System Reserved partition may still create the
System Reserved partition (100 MB) from available space on the existing
C:\partition.

The terabyteunlimited method is one route to avoid/remove the small 100 MB
System Reserved partition. Other options are available if you've access to a
full Windows 7 installation DVD
e.g.
http://www.mydigitallife.info/hack-...reserved-partition-when-installing-windows-7/
or
http://www.sevenforums.com/installation-setup/14858-install-without-100mb-partition-new-drive.html

If using another full version Windows 7 installation DVD (iirc Paul provided
links to obtain the iso file from Digital River[Msft designated hosting
source for Win7] in an earlier thread) ensure you use the same Windows
version as your Acer provided Win7 version (Home, Pro, etc.) and enter the
OEM provided Windows 7 Product Key (should be on the label on your system)
when prompted.

Finally, the Acer Recovery tools won't be available on the new
drive....though that should not be a problem since you're retaining the
original Acer provided drive (Recovery, System, Windows partitions intact)
if needed.

Fyi...Windows 8 creates a 350 MB (System Reserved) partition.

 

[SC Tom]

That's exactly the situation with my last two Acer desktops.

My recovery partition is 100% free; the system reserved 70% free. That
means that it takes the blink of an eye to back them both up. So what I do
each month or so is take a system image of the whole drive. I have 1TB C,
1TB D (which I hardly ever use, preferring to keep all my music and such
on an external disk. The image contains all four partitions.

I do this for the possibility of total disk replacement. In that case the
procedure would be;
1. Replace HD.
2. Restore from last image.

You could, of course, use your plan B; backup just C. And then in the case
of total disk replacement you'd just have to add Start-up Repair as item
3. But that might not create the Acer-style system reserved; probably
won't. And that makes me wary because maybe some Acer utilities need that.
Hence my tactic of putting it on the backup.

That was pretty much my line of thinking, just continue with whole drive
images; it's not hurting anything the way it is, and if I ever get rid of
the laptop, I can always do the Fn+F10 (or Alt+F10, I don't remember which
right now) at boot-up to restore it to factory. The 16GB recovery partition
isn't hurting anything, and certainly isn't making me hurt for space,
either; some games take up almost that much

Thanks for your response!

 

[SC Tom]

Keep in mind that Windows boots from the System partition and stores
its system files on the Boot partition. With that in mind, I believe
the answer is no, the PC will not boot if you restore _only_ the C:
partition to a new drive.

I would make an image of the entire drive. In that case, you could
restore it to another drive and it will be bootable.

That's kinda what I thought, but figured it couldn't hurt to ask. As small
as the other partitions are, it doesn't really make any sense to NOT include
them in the image.

Thanks for your reply!

 

[SC Tom]

"SC Tom" wrote in message I recently bought a new Acer Aspire V3 laptop that came with the Win7
64-bit
setup partition. I ran it, installed Win7, cleaned all the crap off I
didn't
want/need, and installed some of the programs I wanted on it (still more
to
go- that's an ongoing thing, IYKWIM). After I got things the way I wanted,
I
booted from my ATI CD to create an image of the whole drive, including the
hidden "PQService" recovery partition, the 100MB "System Reserved" one,
and
of course, my C: partition.

The question I have is, if I just created an image of the C: partition
without the other two partitions, and restored the C: to a new drive, is
that new drive going to boot on its own, or do you think I'll have to run
Startup Repair to do it? In Disk Management, the System Reserved partition
just says "Healthy (System, Active, Primary Partition)", whereas my C:
says
"Healthy (Boot, Page File, Crash Dump, Primary Partition)". That leads me
to
believe that C: will boot on its own, but just thought I'd ask the opinion
of others here.

I haven't tried deleting the 100MB partition as per the instructions here:

http://www.terabyteunlimited.com/kb/article.php?id=409

since 100MB one way or the other is not really taking a bite out of my
500GB
drive. If I get to the point where I need that 100MB, I think it'll be
time
for a new, larger drive
A. If you restore only the C:\ to a new drive the system won't boot since
it does not contain the bootloader files (see explanation below)

Windows 7, by design during an installation creates the 100MB System
Reserved partition (no drive letter - System Volume) and the Windows
operating system partition (Boot Volume). Both are created on the same
disk (hard drive).
1. When the pc is turned on the BIOS uses its configuration (on an Acer
usually called 'Boot Priority Order') to start the boot process. Normal
those options would be in order of DVD or CD, Hard Disk, USB Fixed Disk
Drive, Network, USB Hard Disk. (DVD being first so one can as you've done
boot from your ATI CD...if DVD/CD is not present/inserted in the DVD/CD
drie slot it moves on to the second prioritized item - Hard Disk)
2. The BIOS passes control to the hard disk containing the System Volume
(System Reserved partition which contains the Windows boot loader files
and the MBR) to start the boot process and determine where the installed
Windows o/s is located. If single boot, only one exists, if dual booting
more than one may exist.
3. The System Volume (System Reserved partition) then passes control to
the Boot Volume (the partition containing the operating system) to load
Windows and finally end up at the Windows logon screen or desktop.

Note:
- The System Volume (System Reserved) not only contains the bootloader
files it also includes the Windows repair utilities..thus if you restore
only the C:\ partition to a new drive, you'll need a Windows DVD (usually
retail) to run the repair option to rebuild the MBR and bootloader files.
- Repairing a drive lacking a System Reserved partition may still create
the System Reserved partition (100 MB) from available space on the
existing C:\partition.

The terabyteunlimited method is one route to avoid/remove the small 100 MB
System Reserved partition. Other options are available if you've access to
a full Windows 7 installation DVD
e.g.
http://www.mydigitallife.info/hack-...reserved-partition-when-installing-windows-7/
or
http://www.sevenforums.com/installation-setup/14858-install-without-100mb-partition-new-drive.html

If using another full version Windows 7 installation DVD (iirc Paul
provided links to obtain the iso file from Digital River[Msft designated
hosting source for Win7] in an earlier thread) ensure you use the same
Windows version as your Acer provided Win7 version (Home, Pro, etc.) and
enter the OEM provided Windows 7 Product Key (should be on the label on
your system) when prompted.

Finally, the Acer Recovery tools won't be available on the new
drive....though that should not be a problem since you're retaining the
original Acer provided drive (Recovery, System, Windows partitions intact)
if needed.

Fyi...Windows 8 creates a 350 MB (System Reserved) partition.

Thanks for your reply! Interesting reading there. I think I'll just continue
with the full drive images, thus avoiding the possibility/probability of
REALLY screwing something up I was just curious about the 100MB
partition since I've never seen it before. Most of the Win7 installations
that I've performed were upgrades from Vista, although my desktop was a
clean install and it wasn't created on it.

I already downloaded the ISO for Win7 HP 64-bit w/SP1 (same as on the
laptop) and created the DVD for emergency purposes (I've had the Digital
River links for years now). Plus I now have the first image of the entire
drive, AND a recovery CD and second internal HDD with the Acer recovery
files safely on the shelf. If something bad happened right now, I could go
back to this morning, or if for some odd reason that image got destroyed, I
have the option of going back to day one. After working IT for so long, I
still get nervous if I don't have something to fall back on. Too many years
of "backup. . . backup. . . backup" to ignore it now

 

[R. C. White]

Hi, Tom.

...is that new drive going to boot on its own,...

No. The "Boot" partition contains ALL of Windows. (It's all in the
C:\Windows folder tree.)

But the "System" partition is the one that tells the BIOS where to find the
Boot partition.

It is entirely possible for a single partition to be both "Boot" and
"System". That's the way it always was - by default - until Win7. And it
can still be that way if we plan for it and install Win7 with that in mind.
But when Win7 Setup.exe installs Win7 onto a "virgin" computer - which is
what an OEM does for computers that are sold with Win7 pre-installed - then
Setup creates that "System Reserved" partition and makes it the "System
Partition". So if that small partition is deleted or reformatted, the
critical startup files are missing and the computer cannot even start, much
less find Win7's Boot partition.

This System/Boot partitions dichotomy is not new; it goes back to at least
WinNT 4.0, which I first encountered in 1998 when I started dual-booting.
The specific contents of the System Partition changed from the
NTLDR/Boot.ini system, used from WinNT 4 through WinXP, to the BCD (Boot
Configuration Data) and bootmgr, beginning with Vista, and then added the
separate System Reserved partition in Win7. Even now, though, if we ADD
Win7 to a computer that already has Windows (XP, Vista, Win2K...) installed,
Setup will detect the existing installation - including the existing System
partition - and will just update the startup files on the partition, rather
than create the new System Reserved partition.

....

I'll quit here, Tom, since I see you already have several good answers. But
I had this much typed before the wife said let's go out to lunch...and I
hate to let it go to waste. Hope it helps. ;<)

RC
--
R. C. White, CPA
San Marcos, TX
(e-mail address removed)
Microsoft Windows MVP (2002-2010)
Windows Live Mail 2012 (Build 16.4.3503.0728)) in Win8 (RTM Ent Eval)



"SC Tom" wrote in message
I recently bought a new Acer Aspire V3 laptop that came with the Win7 64-bit
setup partition. I ran it, installed Win7, cleaned all the crap off I didn't
want/need, and installed some of the programs I wanted on it (still more to
go- that's an ongoing thing, IYKWIM). After I got things the way I wanted, I
booted from my ATI CD to create an image of the whole drive, including the
hidden "PQService" recovery partition, the 100MB "System Reserved" one, and
of course, my C: partition.

The question I have is, if I just created an image of the C: partition
without the other two partitions, and restored the C: to a new drive, is
that new drive going to boot on its own, or do you think I'll have to run
Startup Repair to do it? In Disk Management, the System Reserved partition
just says "Healthy (System, Active, Primary Partition)", whereas my C: says
"Healthy (Boot, Page File, Crash Dump, Primary Partition)". That leads me to
believe that C: will boot on its own, but just thought I'd ask the opinion
of others here.

I haven't tried deleting the 100MB partition as per the instructions here:

http://www.terabyteunlimited.com/kb/article.php?id=409

since 100MB one way or the other is not really taking a bite out of my 500GB
drive. If I get to the point where I need that 100MB, I think it'll be time
for a new, larger drive

TIA!

 

[SC Tom]

Thanks for the reply, R.C. Please see some of my replies in-line.

Hi, Tom.


No. The "Boot" partition contains ALL of Windows. (It's all in the
C:\Windows folder tree.)

But the "System" partition is the one that tells the BIOS where to find
the Boot partition.

It is entirely possible for a single partition to be both "Boot" and
"System". That's the way it always was - by default - until Win7. And it
can still be that way if we plan for it and install Win7 with that in
mind. But when Win7 Setup.exe installs Win7 onto a "virgin" computer -
which is what an OEM does for computers that are sold with Win7
pre-installed - then Setup creates that "System Reserved" partition and
makes it the "System Partition". So if that small partition is deleted or
reformatted, the critical startup files are missing and the computer
cannot even start, much less find Win7's Boot partition.

I did a clean installation on my desktop of Win7, and it didn't create the
100MB partition. It was on a blank HDD, and I don't recall doing anything
special during the installation. I did use an upgrade DVD to do it; would
that possibly be the reason?

Wouldn't it be feasible, after deleting the partition, to boot from the
installation DVD and do a startup or MBR repair? I haven't done any of that
stuff for quite some time now (other than for friends or neighbors), but I
don't really miss it

This System/Boot partitions dichotomy is not new; it goes back to at least
WinNT 4.0, which I first encountered in 1998 when I started dual-booting.
The specific contents of the System Partition changed from the
NTLDR/Boot.ini system, used from WinNT 4 through WinXP, to the BCD (Boot
Configuration Data) and bootmgr, beginning with Vista, and then added the
separate System Reserved partition in Win7. Even now, though, if we ADD
Win7 to a computer that already has Windows (XP, Vista, Win2K...)
installed, Setup will detect the existing installation - including the
existing System partition - and will just update the startup files on the
partition, rather than create the new System Reserved partition.

...

I'll quit here, Tom, since I see you already have several good answers.
But I had this much typed before the wife said let's go out to lunch...and
I hate to let it go to waste. Hope it helps. ;<)

Never waste a lunch (or a wife's invitation)

 

[FD]

http://www.terabyteunlimited.com/kb/article.php?id=409

since 100MB one way or the other is not really taking a bite out of my 500GB drive. If I get to the point where I need that 100MB, I think it'll be
time for a new, larger drive

I have a much simple way of getting rid of this partition.

I have a CD with Acronis Disk Director.

Boot up from CD

Delete system reserved partion.

Mark Windows as active partition.

The system is now unbootable.

I would then boot with my windows 7 DVD and do a repair.

It will require 2-3 efforts to do repair and the windows will become
bootable.

I have also done that windows 8 Enterprise evaluation that
I am using. (90 day trial)

FD

 

[Bob I]

I have a much simple way of getting rid of this partition.

I have a CD with Acronis Disk Director.

Boot up from CD

Delete system reserved partion.

Mark Windows as active partition.

The system is now unbootable.

I would then boot with my windows 7 DVD and do a repair.

It will require 2-3 efforts to do repair and the windows will become
bootable.

I have also done that windows 8 Enterprise evaluation that
I am using. (90 day trial)

What a waste of time.

http://www.urtech.ca/2011/04/solved-what-is-the-100mb-partition-on-all-windows-7-boot-disks/

 

[FD]

What a waste of time.

It may be a "waste of time" (about 10 minutes) but has made my task of imaging with Acronis
and restoring images when necessary much less complicated

FD

 

[...winston]

"Bob I" wrote in message

What a waste of time.
http://www.urtech.ca/2011/04/solved-what-is-the-100mb-partition-on-all-windows-7-boot-disks/

There's a subtle difference.
The op already had Windows 7 installed and wanted to remove the 100 MB System Reserved Partition to make imaging easier by imaging
only a single partition.

The video showed how to install Windows 7 to a blank drive (not remove the system reserved from an existing Win7 installation)


The end result is the same (regarding imaging a sole partition for later restoration) but the latter requires reinstalling the
entire operating system to achieve that objective.

 

[SC Tom]

It may be a "waste of time" (about 10 minutes) but has made my task of
imaging with Acronis
and restoring images when necessary much less complicated

I use ATI also for my disk imaging (as stated in the OP in this thread), and
don't find that it complicates anything by including this tiny little
partition in the image, or restoring that image (I have since tested it out
on a spare HDD with no problems). If it was a 25GB+ partition, then I might
consider getting rid of it, but since it's not really hurting anything or
taking up necessary HDD space, I'll leave it as is.

 

[Char Jackson]

I use ATI also for my disk imaging (as stated in the OP in this thread), and
don't find that it complicates anything by including this tiny little
partition in the image, or restoring that image (I have since tested it out
on a spare HDD with no problems). If it was a 25GB+ partition, then I might
consider getting rid of it, but since it's not really hurting anything or
taking up necessary HDD space, I'll leave it as is.

+1